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 THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1

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The Admiral
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PostSubject: Re: THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1   THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 I_icon_minitimeSat Mar 05, 2011 1:14 pm

With Zuckus i think the same as the AT-ST Marcos - wrong paints applied, regardless of the colours used are the figures from the same mould/s? Are there Ledy Zuckus variants in that the Datestamp/COO scar differ? Post your thoughts/findings people Smile
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PostSubject: Re: THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1   THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 I_icon_minitimeSat Mar 05, 2011 3:14 pm


  • Who likes to contact Tom D to ask him how he thinks about the silver and grey belt versions and how they relate to Ledy.
  • Who can post a clear pic of a Made in China Zuckuss baggie. I am very curious how this figure looks like. Exactly like the 'silver belt' 'Zuckuss as shown in the pics above or differently. Del?
  • Can we exclude that the grey belt is a discolored silver belt, in which the silver pigments have been oxidized to darker pigments?
  • I have found a few pics of Ledy MOCs, see below. Difficult to say: grey or silver belt? I would say both MOCs have a grey belt Zuckuss. Who can post pics of other Ledy MOCs? Some Mexican input would be much welcomed here!





Here is a picture of my Made in China Zuckuss baggie. It has all the Ledy features and the silver belt.

THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 00710
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PostSubject: Re: THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1   THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 I_icon_minitimeSat Mar 05, 2011 3:22 pm

All the Ledy features - the same Datestamp/COO scar etc Bill?
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PostSubject: Re: THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1   THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 I_icon_minitimeSat Mar 05, 2011 3:33 pm

@The Admiral wrote:
All the Ledy features - the same Datestamp/COO scar etc Bill?

THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 00514
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PostSubject: Re: THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1   THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 I_icon_minitimeSat Mar 05, 2011 3:55 pm

Ok, how does he compare to any of the photos on the previous page Bill? Easier for you to tell with having the baggie to look at, can you list any differences noted please?
Minor differences were looking for, the small hard to notice things like perhaps a Datestamp with some very minor difference etc or something unique thats not on another figure
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PostSubject: Re: THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1   THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 I_icon_minitimeSat Mar 05, 2011 4:53 pm

@The Admiral wrote:
Ok, how does he compare to any of the photos on the previous page Bill? Easier for you to tell with having the baggie to look at, can you list any differences noted please?
Minor differences were looking for, the small hard to notice things like perhaps a Datestamp with some very minor difference etc or something unique thats not on another figure

I have a loose complete Ledy Zuckuss I purchased in a small lot from a mexican seller also. The figures share the same coo, scar, heel circles, back knee circles. The Ledy has the darker belt, darker red nose, glossy eyes, glossy and a bit darker head. I really can't tell if either body is darker or not though. I can't tell any differences in the weapon either.


Last edited by BILLIAM666 on Sat Mar 05, 2011 5:10 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1   THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 I_icon_minitimeSat Mar 05, 2011 5:07 pm

Ok thanks for that Bill, is there any chance you can get a macro closeup of the datestamp and the coo scar of the baggy one?
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PostSubject: Re: THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1   THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 I_icon_minitimeSat Mar 05, 2011 7:51 pm

Hi all,

I was given this Luke Bespin recently and told that it was Lili Ledy....

I have checked on the COO guide and multiple other variant websites but cannot get anything to conclusively say that it is or isn't so I remain unsure.......my opinion is that it isn't Lili due to the raised bar not going further down the leg than the fold in the pants (and isn't it supposed to have luke jedi head?).........any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks


THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 Dscf2113

THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 Dscf2111


Last edited by Serket on Sat Mar 05, 2011 8:35 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1   THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 I_icon_minitimeSat Mar 05, 2011 8:15 pm

@Serket wrote:
Hi all,

I was given this Luke Bespin recently and told that it was Lily.....

I have chaecked on the COO guide but am not 100% sure.......can anyone help?


Hi,

The COO looks OK but is not unique, both the Kenner and Ledy/PBP Luke Bespin have this COO.

Can you post some pics of the figure? There are a lot of Ledy collectors out here who are willing to help you.

But please do so in a new thread, so we can keep focus on the Zuckuss discussion right now. Very Happy


Cheers

BTW: I posted a similar question here (scroll down a bit), maybe that might help you as well.





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PostSubject: Re: THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1   THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 I_icon_minitimeSat Mar 05, 2011 8:46 pm

No worries....cheers
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PostSubject: Re: THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1   THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 I_icon_minitimeSat Mar 05, 2011 11:49 pm

Ledy Zuckus V China Baggy Zuckus.

Conclusions so far:

Darker Silver Belt on the Ledy.
Darker Red Nose on the Ledy.
Glossy Eyes on the Ledy.
Head appears Glossy and darker on Ledy? (needs defined/confirmed).

Thanks for the info and pix Bill Smile

Awaiting any Macro shots of China Baggy COO Scar and DateStamp.




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PostSubject: Re: THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1   THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 I_icon_minitimeSun Mar 06, 2011 12:49 am

Yo peep's here are some pic's of my ledy Zuckuss.
The LL is on the left in all the pic's.The one on right his variant?Let's find out let er rip. meeting
THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 Ll_ree10
THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 Ll_ree11
THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 Ll_ree12
THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 Ll_ree13
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PostSubject: Re: THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1   THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 I_icon_minitimeSun Mar 06, 2011 1:13 am

What differences are there Dan? They both look the same in the photos apart from ones more yellowed? than the other.

Or is it the Silver Belt? (hard to tell for me).

Also to classify as a true variant he should be made from a different mould and the difference/s should be noticeable IMO, Ledy got all kinds of paint jobs wrong/mixed/etc, if you want paint variants youve come to the right place lol.

Think of looking in detail at DateStamps/Scars etc and think of the Ledy Stormy V2 - very minute details that were not noticed for a long time Smile
Some detective work required, grab a magnifying glass lads.

Can you see any mould differences in yours Jason?

Your 1. AFA 85 - Silver shiney belt, Matt eyes and brighter red nose AFA'd as Ledy doesnt fit the usual Ledy bill (paint-wise), are there any differences in DateStamp/Scar?

(i love this bit ... finding possible variants Smile ) ... or failed Grading attemps? pirat

We await any detailled reports Smile
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PostSubject: Re: THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1   THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 I_icon_minitimeSun Mar 06, 2011 6:01 am

I took a very close look at my two Zuckuss figures this morning. One has the shiny silver belt (and bright red nose, glossy blue eyes), the other has the dull silver ("grey") belt (and deep red nose and matt blue eyes). First of all I noticed that there is actually no difference in the colour of the head, limbs and body, so I will change that in his entry on page 1. There is also no significant difference in the COO: the datestamp (right leg) and the partly erased "Made in Hong Kong" (left leg) all look the same to me. Yes when looking with a magnifier glass you can argue that the ‘’remainings’’ of the "Made in Hong Kong" text might differ a tiny bit, but come on we don't want to identify Ledy figures with a microscope, do we? Very Happy

Interestingly I noticed a molding difference. The dull silver belt version has dents in both his legs. Well this might be a coincidence off course which only applies for the figure which I was examining. Luckily Dan posted some pics in this thread earlier today. His pics show the same two Zuckuss variants as in my pics. I admit that I almost jumped into the air out of joy when I saw that his dull silver belt version has dents too.

I don't know whether the dents were actually crafted in the molding itself or an artifact when releasing the cast figures from the molding. Fact is I don't see the dents in the shiny belt version. So these two variants are not ‘just’ paint variants but they also differ in the way they were produced: different molding, or different process settings.

This strongly supports a theory that both variants were actually made in different factories. I would say the dull silver belt was produced in the Lili Ledy factory. Look at the MOCs on the previous page. The release of dented Zuckuss figures fits perfectly in the scheme of Ledy’s poor quality control. Inconsistent quality control might also be the reason that Dan’s Zuckuss has only one dent on the right leg, whereas mine has dents on both legs.

Here a few pics to explain what I am talking about:

Zuckuss: Made in China (left), Ledy (right). Note the differences in the colour of the nose (bright/deep red) and eyes (glossy/matt blue).
THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 IMG_4211

THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 Dia1-5

THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 Dia2-3



  • All: Can you check your dull silver belt Zuckuss variants for dents and post your experiences. We need some confirmation to support this theory.
  • Bill can you confirm whether your Zuckuss from the Made in China baggy is identical to the silver belt version in my pics: belt, nose, eyes, COO, and most importantly: absence of dents.


EDIT: Later in this thread it appeared that the Made in China Zuckuss can have dents too and the dents are therefore not exclusive for the Ledy Zuckuss.
Maybe the dents appeared 'randomly' during processing or after frequent usage of the moldings, irrespective in which factory (China, Mexico) Zuckuss was produced.



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PostSubject: Re: THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1   THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 I_icon_minitimeSun Mar 06, 2011 6:59 am

Ok here we go, i had to let my Zuckus bust out of his dodgy tomb ...

THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 Z1_2
THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 Z2_2
THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 Z3_2
THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 Z4_2

And once revealed he is ...

Matt Silver Belt. (The term Dark Silver needs changed IMO as its more of a Matt Silver or Grey, Gloss Silver? should be a bright colour like the China)
Dark Red Nose.
Glossy Eyes.

and ...

THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 Z5_2


Not as pronounced/as large as on yours but it is evident on both legs, also noticed it is on Jasons AFA no1s Left Leg.
It would appear the Gloss Silver paint was also used by Ledy and is just a quality control issue?
THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 Z6_2
It will be interesting to see if Jasons AFA numbers 2 + 3 have the same/similar marks.

Mould problem with the Ledy "Matt Silver" Belt it would appear, and some were painted with the Gloss Silver? (Better define these colours too).

I just looked at 2 other photos of the Ledy Zuckus and they too have similar marks in those areas, could be something unique to Ledy Smile
More photos peeps Smile

Also looking at your Kenners Left Leg he has some issues in the same area going upwards it seems (Bottom left photo).
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PostSubject: Re: THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1   THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 I_icon_minitimeSun Mar 06, 2011 7:35 am

I went to the attic to get my other Ledy Zuckuss and made a group picture together with his Mexican brother and Chinese cousin from the previous pics. Like the other Ledy figure he has a dent as well, but this time only on one leg.

Left: Shiny silver belt Zuckuss (Made in China). Middle and Right: Dull silver belt (Ledy).
THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 IMG_4212

Left: Shiny silver belt Zuckuss (Made in China). Middle and Right: Dull silver belt (Ledy).
THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 IMG_4215

Your resurrected Zuckuss lol! has the dull grey belt Rob? That would fit as he has dents as well.

NOTE: It might be that the presence of dents is the only specific distinctive Ledy trait here. That would mean that the paint of the nose, eyes and even the belt might vary also within the ‘population’ of Ledy Zuckuss figures, we have seen this more often for Ledy figures. That would explain the dent in Jason's AFA cased Zuckuss and would indentify him as a Ledy indeed (though having a shiny instead of dull silver belt, and a bright instead of dark red nose). Let's await the pics from the China baggies first before jumping to conclusions too fast.
China Zuckuss: dent or no dent that is the question.
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PostSubject: Re: THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1   THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 I_icon_minitimeSun Mar 06, 2011 7:58 am

Yes he has the Dull Grey Belt, i have now seen 7 different Ledy Zuckus with similar marks on the leg/s (other photos around the net), and it is indeed looking like a Ledy trait, however with it looking different and being sometimes 2 legs it could be mould degeneration over time? If thats the case there should be ones without this mark? We need more pix/results, yes and China Baggy checked again.
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PostSubject: Re: THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1   THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 I_icon_minitimeSun Mar 06, 2011 9:38 am

@The Admiral wrote:
Yes he has the Dull Grey Belt, i have now seen 7 different Ledy Zuckus with similar marks on the leg/s (other photos around the net), and it is indeed looking like a Ledy trait, however with it looking different and being sometimes 2 legs it could be mould degeneration over time? If thats the case there should be ones without this mark? We need more pix/results, yes and China Baggy checked again.

I will try to get you guys some close ups of their legs tonight. All 3 have marks on the front of their legs.

Jason
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PostSubject: Re: THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1   THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 I_icon_minitimeSun Mar 06, 2011 1:02 pm

THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 China_10THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 China_11

China baggie scar & date stamp.

THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 China_12

China baggie dent on right leg only,and has matt eyes

THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 Lili_l10THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 Ledy_l11

My Ledy has dents on both legs. Ledy on left and what I believe to be a China on the right (w/silver belt), both figures have dents.
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PostSubject: Re: THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1   THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 I_icon_minitimeSun Mar 06, 2011 1:19 pm

Many thanks Bill!

So it seems the Made in China Zuckuss can have dents too and the dents are therefore not exclusive for the Ledy Zuckuss.

Maybe the dents appeared 'randomly' during processing or after frequent usage of the moldings, irrespective in which factory (China, Mexico) Zuckuss was produced.

Sofar the dents theory. Pity it did not hold. Very Happy

So back to the old theory:
  • Zuckuss from Made in China baggie: shiny silver belt, bright red nose, glossy blue eyes, no dents may appear
  • Ledy Zuckuss: dull silver belt, dark red nose, matt blue eyes, dents may appear.


We need pics of MOCs to find a concluding answer.




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PostSubject: Re: THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1   THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 I_icon_minitimeSun Mar 06, 2011 1:42 pm

Thanks for your help Bill, good work Smile

Do you see any small differences with the Baggy Scar/Datestamp Bill?

I would be surprised if its just down to paint differences, legally they usually make a change to the mould for traceability.

For the moment its basically down to the eye colour used, look harder men - where is that Ledy Mark hiding Smile

China Baggy has Matt Eyes.
Ledy has Glossy Eyes.

UPDATE:

Different Detail Noticed Smile
THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 C-v-l_2

China Baggy has Matt Eyes.
Ledy has Glossy Eyes.
Ledy has a larger "Belly Button Bolt" Smile - More Comparisons Needed!


May even be others not noticed yet, were looking for fine detail now, i dont have a China Zuckus but noticed that in your photo Marco Wink

Your one on the right Bill looks like a Ledy if were going by Bolt Sizes.
Would also like someone who has both these figures to compare those COO Scars and DateStamps for minute "Microscopic" details.... Like this...

THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 Datestamp-detail_2

Notice the Ledy has a clearer ©️ (This comparison between the Ledy Zuckus (top) and a No-Circle Heel Zuckus ).
This is the kind of detail we need to look for, bring out that Detective in yourself Smile

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PostSubject: Re: THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1   THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 I_icon_minitimeSun Mar 06, 2011 3:32 pm

Dear Watson Very Happy I am afraid I have some bad news for you:

I checked my figures with a magnifier glass looking for any subtle molding differences between the shiny (China) and dull (Ledy) silver belt Zuckuss. This time I neglected the dents. Very Happy. Unfortunately I could not find any differences.

Also the belt detail you detected (good observation!) must be an photographic artifact as I don't see any difference in the size for the small belt dot when comparing my two Ledy Zuckuss’ to the China Zuckuss.

One Ledy Zuckuss indeed has a less detailed ©️ symbol, as in your bottom pic. To me it looks slightly deformed and might be an artifact during production as we have seen before in this thread for Yoda and Gamorrean Guard. This belief is strengthened by the fact that the other Ledy Zuckuss has the more detailed ©️, the same as my China and Made in Hong Kong Zuckuss. On the other hand it might be that are are indeed two diffrent COOs for the Ledy Zuckuss. One way or the other, the form of the ©️ is hardly distinctive imo. Pls proof me wrong here, I don't mind cause it would be good to have a distinctive Ledy trait.

What to do now? Do we really need to look for molding differences?
Can paint variations alone never be distinctive for Ledy figures? There are at least a few figures for which there is only one type of COO, and I assume only one molding. In this case the differences between between Kenner and Ledy are ‘just’ paint variations. Take Nikto for instance, or Weequay.

Maybe that is the case for other figures as well. For instance Zuckuss.

Ledy research never gets boring, keep on the good work guys! Very Happy



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PostSubject: Re: THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1   THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 I_icon_minitimeSun Mar 06, 2011 3:58 pm

Yes i still do consider little mould differences important as it can be 1 more step to correct identification or a possible variant find.

What about the length/positioning of the COO Scar?

Only when things like these details are covered properly can we move on and put it down to paint types/colour differences.

(Note the Emperor pic i added to Dev section - that ©️ is one little helper in that case and yes - may become deformed and make things that little bit harder to tell no doubt over time ).

Its elementary my Dear Watson Razz
(And should be compulsary) Wink

I say give it a few days before we close the "Zuckus Case", see what other info appears?
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PostSubject: Re: THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1   THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 I_icon_minitimeTue Mar 08, 2011 5:12 am

To me Ledy is grey not silver belt, slightly darker, glossy eyes & more red 'nose'
THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 SDC11917
it does have the leg 'dents' and mine has a 'bump' on top of the right foot (could just be a flaw)
THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 SDC11916
THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 SDC11915
it does seem to have the slightly bigger 'bellybutton' but no difference in the copyright symbol.
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The Admiral
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THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 Empty
PostSubject: Re: THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1   THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 I_icon_minitimeTue Mar 08, 2011 5:24 am

Yah but Jasons AFA Silver Belt Ledy kinda upsets that logic James, interesting tho you say the Ledy body is darker (obviously hard to tell on some).

Very interesting you noticed a larger "Belly Button" tho Smile Get the Navel Fluff Vacuum Cleaners out lads and check those Belly Buttons again please, would just like to see if this is a Ledy trait or another anomoly, or possibly a variant Smile
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THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 Empty
PostSubject: Re: THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1   THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1 - Page 7 I_icon_minitime

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THE LILI LEDY GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD PART 1

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