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 THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE

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Dr Dengar
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THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Empty
PostSubject: Re: THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE   THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 I_icon_minitimeSat Feb 09, 2013 6:59 am

Follow up from page 19: http://www.imperialgunneryforum.com/t4427p270-the-poch-pbp-discussion-thread

Below you see comparison pics between a Bossk from Spain and a Kenner Bossk, both having COO#1.
A POCH Bossk with COO#3 was also included to show the differences in the degree of green of the limbs (no green, brownish green, toxic green)


Bossk: Kenner COO#1 (left), Figure from Spain with COO#1 (middle), confirmed POCH Bossk with COO #3 (right).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7084_zps04046c7f

Bossk: Kenner COO#1 (left), Figure from Spain with COO#1 (middle), confirmed POCH Bossk with COO #3 (right).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7085_zps7f62ee02

Bossk: Kenner COO#1 (left), Figure from Spain with COO#1 (middle), confirmed POCH Bossk with COO #3 (right).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7086_zps40030286

Bossk: Kenner COO#1 (left), Figure from Spain with COO#1 (middle), confirmed POCH Bossk with COO #3 (right).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7089_zpsa8f1c1a5



Compared to his Kenner brother, the Bossk from Spain has:

  • Greenish limbs. probably due to discolouration. Not so green as the confimred POCH Bossk though. ( see also http://swspaceclub.com/wbobafett/poch-variants/bossk/ )
  • Paler yellow limbs, probably also due to discolouration, Note that the Kenner version also has pale limbs, but less pronounced.
  • Small chest cross
  • Typical PBP smell
  • Bigger pupils
  • Darker red lips and eyes



This figure pops up in Spanish childhood collections and therefore it seems very likely that it was available in Spain during the 80s. To me this figure has clear differences compared to his Kenner brother.

I am curious what you think.



...here is a family shot.

From left to right:
- Kenner COO#1
- Figure from Spain COO#1
- POCH Boskk COO#3
- PBP Bossk COO#4

THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7090_zps7fd73d90


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Dr Dengar
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THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Empty
PostSubject: Re: THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE   THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 I_icon_minitimeSat Feb 09, 2013 7:55 am

From what I understood, the Cantina Aliens made their first appearance on 45/47 El Imperio Contraataca cards in Spain.

THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Hammerhead_45-47b_tnTHE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Snaggletooth_45-47b_tnTHE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Walrusman_45-47b_tn

Source: http://www.starwarsspanishstuff.info

I was wondering what type of figures were released on these early cards. Different options are possible:

  1. Hong Kong figures with small paint differences. Possibly welded/painted in Spain like the confirmed early POCH figures on 37/41 backs: Class I/II Figures.
  2. Imported HK figures: Class IV figures.
  3. Spanish produced PBP Cantina Aliens with scarred COO: Class III Figures.
  4. A combination the above options



Today I received a Hong Kong Hammerhead from a Spanish childhood collection. The guy told me that he had received all SW and ESB characters from ESB cards when he was young (and ROTJ characters from ROTJ cards).

I had no reason to disbelieve him as many of his SW and ESB figures were indeed confirmed early POCH variants, which were released on ESB 37/41 backs.
So I thought this Hammerhead could therefore shed some more light on the topic.

Let's find out.....


Below I made some comparison shots.

Hammerhead: PBP scarred COO (left), Kenner HK COO (middle), Spanish childhood figure HK COO (right).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7068_zps72969c59

Hammerhead: PBP scarred COO (left), Kenner HK COO (middle), Spanish childhood figure HK COO (right).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7069_zps8d774b9d

Hammerhead: PBP scarred COO (left), Kenner HK COO (middle), Spanish childhood figure HK COO (right).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7070_zpscbe8f474


I don't know what you see, but I conclude there is no difference between the middle and right figure. This makes option 2 most valid at the moment.
It seems unlikely that PBP (POCH) welded/painted Hong Kong Hammerheads, like they did for (some of?) the characters which were released on the 37/41 backs. Probalby this extends to the other Cantina Aliens as well.

So statement to be tested:

PBP did not weld/paint any of the Hong Kong Cantina Aliens, instead these figures were being imported.

Later PBP produced their own Cantina Aliens (with scarred COO).


Curious what you think...

Does the statement hold? unsure




EDIT: It appears that the 45-backs already contained PBP's own produced figures (Class III).

http://www.imperialgunneryforum.com/t4427p540-the-poch-pbp-Post-thread#99161


Last edited by Dr Dengar on Sat Jun 08, 2013 11:19 am; edited 1 time in total
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Dr Dengar
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PostSubject: Re: THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE   THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 I_icon_minitimeSat Feb 09, 2013 8:23 am

I also received a Luke X-Wing from the same childhood collection. It is the figure on the right in the pics below.

I am very pleased with him as his emblems are still very well conserved.

Luke X-Wing, from left to right:
- Kenner Hong Kong COO
- POCH Hong Kong COO
- POCH Hong Kong COO

THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7078_zps293dfeb4

THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7079_zps1952017a

THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7080_zps25b7cdf4

THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7082_zps050f2850


Compared to his Kenner brother, the POCH Lukes have:
- Pale hands
- A bit darker orange skin of the face
- Different spray mask used for the chest device, e.g. the little red square in the top right corner.
- And a few other imperfections we don't talk about anymore. Cool

Read more in Wolff's guide: http://swspaceclub.com/wbobafett/poch-variants/luke-pilot/

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Dr Dengar
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PostSubject: Re: THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE   THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 I_icon_minitimeSat Feb 09, 2013 9:15 am

I also received a Death Star Droid from the same Spanish childhood collection. I compared him to two Kenner DSDs having the same COO.

Might this be a early POCH droid, released on a 37/41 back?

Death Star Droid: Kenner COO#1 (left + middle), Figure from Spain with COO#1 (right).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7106_zps5fe6f23a

Death Star Droid: Kenner COO#1 (left + middle), Figure from Spain with COO#1 (right).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7107_zpsf1b6e93c

Death Star Droid: Kenner COO#1 (left + middle), Figure from Spain with COO#1 (right).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7108_zps2137cf61

Death Star Droid: Kenner COO#1 (left + middle), Figure from Spain with COO#1 (right).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7109_zpse5cc504b

Death Star Droid: Kenner COO#1 (left + middle), Figure from Spain with COO#1 (right).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7110_zps94c3e77e


Do you see any convincing differences? :scratch:

I don't.


Options:

  1. This is no POCH figure.
  2. POCH produced/welded/painted DSD figures do not exist at all, only imported HK figure which were put on El Imperio Contraataca cards.
  3. POCH produced/welded/painted DSD figures do exist, but there is no important difference compared to Kenner figures


What is the best option? unsure

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ackbar100
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THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Empty
PostSubject: Re: THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE   THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 I_icon_minitimeSat Feb 09, 2013 9:35 am

I think I have to do it.

There is not enough money in the world to pay Dr Dengar for his effort to keep this threat running.

You are doing an incredible job and your collection is really on the top. CONGRATULATIONS

Sinceraly
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Dr Dengar
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PostSubject: Re: THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE   THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 I_icon_minitimeSat Feb 09, 2013 9:48 am

A while ago I obtained a Tusken raider from a (different) Spanish childhood collection, which also contained a few confirmed early POCH figures.

Time for a comparison! Very Happy



Tusken Raider: Kenner (left + middle), Figure from Spain (right).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7104_zpsf5ccb8a4

Tusken Raider: Kenner (left + middle), Figure from Spain (right).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7105_zpsb8c083b9

Tusken Raider: Kenner (left + middle), Figure from Spain (right).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7098_zps7d512e0a

Tusken Raider: Kenner (left + middle), Figure from Spain (right).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7099_zpsdb46317f

Tusken Raider: Kenner (left + middle), Figure from Spain (right).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7102_zpsd1124d04

Tusken Raider: Kenner (left + middle), Figure from Spain (right).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7101_zpsffadb839


The most obvious difference between the Tusken Raider from Spain and the Kenner figures is the colour of the bandolier. It is darkbrown with a strong hint of purple, almost eggplant colour. Though Kenner figures can differ very much (light/medium/dark brown bandoliers and gloves), I haven't seen this type of bandolier colour on any of my Kenner figures (I checked about 10).

Apart from the bandolier and a few obvious imperfections (which I won't mention to keep focus on paint differences Very Happy ), there are no much differences.
Also the cape looks like a regular Kenner to me, making typical zip sounds on one side.


Are we looking at a POCH figure here?


Wolff mentions a "slightly more reddish...or more violet..." colour of the bandolier for the POCH variant in his limelight.
The bandolier seems lighter in colour than mine, however. unsure

From : http://www.imperialgunneryforum.com/t4350-anh-loose-figures-variants-bootlegs_wip

@wbobafett wrote:



12. Tusken

THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 SW_10_Tusken1a
The Tusken is not so easy to describe. I havent had the time yet to make research on the mold differences and to sort out the mold-familys, but eh.....its nearly the same on all. Its about 2-3 familys...my guess is two, but havent checked! On one family (about 6 coos) you can find hollow tubes and all 4 maincolors.
- 4 different main colors are known to the Tusken: orangish brown, lightbrown, darkbrown and very darkbrown. These can be found on nearly all coos (besides the large copyright HK ones)
- The 5th figure is the actual Poch variant. His brown town is a bit different to all known versions...its slightly more reddish...or more violet...definatley different.


Let's discuss! cheers





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Dr Dengar
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THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Empty
PostSubject: Re: THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE   THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 I_icon_minitimeSat Feb 09, 2013 9:59 am

@ackbar100 wrote:
I think I have to do it.

There is not enough money in the world to pay Dr Dengar for his effort to keep this threat running.

You are doing an incredible job and your collection is really on the top. CONGRATULATIONS

Sinceraly

Thank you, much appreciated!! Very Happy
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ackbar100
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THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Empty
PostSubject: Re: THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE   THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 I_icon_minitimeSat Feb 09, 2013 10:20 am

Here you are my DS Droid. IN MY OPINION, it could be a poch one. It has bad application with the painting -see black shoulders-, big mark on the head -I have seen this mark in poch darth vaders before- and melt marks on the back. On the face it has 2 black lines only in the front. My kenner one has painted the fron and one side with 2 lines.

I hope this helps.

THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Dsdroid1
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Dsdroid2
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Dsdroid12
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Dsdroid3
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Dsdroid4
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Dsdroid5
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Dsdroid6
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Dsdroid7
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Dsdroid8
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Dsdroid9
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Dsdroid10
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Dsdroid11



Last edited by ackbar100 on Sat Feb 09, 2013 11:36 am; edited 1 time in total
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Dr Dengar
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PostSubject: Re: THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE   THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 I_icon_minitimeSat Feb 09, 2013 11:27 am


Thank you for posting these pics, Ricardo. cheers

When we leave out the imperfections (like melt marks), I wonder which features might be distinctive for a possible POCH figure.

Also Kenner DSDs are notorious for their poor paint application. You only have to look at the paint and it is already gone. Very Happy
So poor paint application is not so strong difference.


However I see one thing which my and your DSD have in common. A very light paint application on the eyes. The eyes look more brownish than black, because the silver metal shines through the black paint.

None of my Kenner DSDs have this. they all have very black eyes, though the paint on the shoulders is sometimes poor.

Maybe that means something.... unsure


@ All: Are there more Spanish DSDs out there?
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THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Empty
PostSubject: Re: THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE   THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 I_icon_minitimeSat Feb 09, 2013 11:41 am

You are right, Dr Dengar. Melt marks are not key in this but you have to consider the head mark as well seen it in other poch figures. Anyway, I have edited my post to avoid misunderstandings Smile

Please, could you check if your 2 kenner figures have painted 2 lines in one side of the face????

I don't know if it is important but my kenner figure is most detailed in the face than the poch?? one. Is the same in your figures??
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Dr Dengar
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THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Empty
PostSubject: Re: THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE   THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 I_icon_minitimeSun Feb 10, 2013 6:58 am

Hey Ricardo,

I made some compariosn shots.

In all pics, the middle (bottom) figure is the Death Star Droid from Spain. The other four are Kenner figures.

Do you or anybody else see differences with respect to the black painting in the face (eyes and mouth piece)?


THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7112_zps4d9d362a

THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7115_zps6b4aa852

THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7121_zps2c54553e

THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7123_zps60ea07ba

THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7125_zps2e605fa4





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THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Empty
PostSubject: Re: THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE   THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 I_icon_minitimeSun Feb 10, 2013 10:29 am

Hi Dr Dengar,

it seems you are right in your comments. The only difference that I see in your pictures is the color eyes -kenner uses a dark black vs the other figure- looking the figure face to face.

Here I add new pictures of my DS droid kenner and the spanish figure -get it here-. They have the same color diferences in the eyes than your pictures and you can see the mark in the back neck as well much better. take a look to the left shoulder of the spanish figure. It is really a bad painting aplication or retouch.

Kenner on the left. Spanish figure on the ritht

THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Catalogopbp82005
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Catalogopbp82006
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Catalogopbp82009
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Catalogopbp82011
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Catalogopbp82013
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Catalogopbp82015
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PostSubject: Re: THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE   THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 I_icon_minitimeSun Feb 10, 2013 11:59 am

[img]THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Death_15[/img][img]THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Death_16[/img]

I am not an expert by any means but aside from the lighter paint application there appears to be less detail definition in the cheek bump on both figures. I used your photos to show this common trait that both seem to have. The kenner one from Marco also has this but when coupled with the lighter paint application maybe this is something else that all have in common?

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PostSubject: Re: THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE   THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 I_icon_minitimeSun Feb 10, 2013 12:52 pm


The lighter paint application of the eyes might be common for DSDs from Spain. Just based upon the two Spanish droids in this thread.

Still this is not a very clear difference, I can imagine weathered Kenner figures can have similar eyes. But off course you don't expect much differences for a figure which has only silver and black paint. No chocolate legs and black neck here. Very Happy

Question remains whether my and Ricardo's droids can be linked to POCH 37/41 backs.

Is there a MOC known? We could check the lighter paint app of the eyes then..
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Bryan, thanks for joining! Very Happy

The Kenner figures in my pics have either COO#1 or #2.

Maybe these COOs are linked to different steel moulds, explaining the cheek bump differences? :scratch:
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PostSubject: Re: THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE   THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 I_icon_minitimeMon Feb 11, 2013 12:40 pm

@Dr Dengar wrote:

Is there a MOC known? We could check the lighter paint app of the eyes then..

Until last year it was still not proven that these MOC exists until 2 or 3 cardbacks have popped last year.
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PostSubject: Re: THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE   THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 I_icon_minitimeMon Feb 11, 2013 1:35 pm



Thanks Mirco for telling.

Would love to see those 37/41 DSD cardbacks.

On www.starwarsspanishstuff.info the only DSD card which is shown is the Trilogo version.

Which makes me wonder, whether DSDs were released on ESB 45/47 backs and the ROTJ 65 backs?
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I know a collector which has a POCH Death Star Droid in his limelight.

Maybe he can shed some more light on this topic.


Let's try to call him....


THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Wolve_zpsa98563e9
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@Dr Dengar wrote:

Bryan, thanks for joining! Very Happy

The Kenner figures in my pics have either COO#1 or #2.

Maybe these COOs are linked to different steel moulds, explaining the cheek bump differences? :scratch:

THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Death_15

Bryan, I checked the COOs of the figures in the picture above. Thanks for making the pic. Very Happy

Going from the figure in the middle (bottom) and then counter clock wise they are

COO#1: Figure from Spain
COO#1: Kenner
COO#2: Kenner, with cheeck bump
COO#2: kenner, with cheeck bump
COO#1: Kenner, with cheeck bump

The cheek bump does not seem to be linked to a certain COO. The Spanish figure lacks this bump, but so is the Kenner figure right next to it.


THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Death_13
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Dr Dengar
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THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Empty
PostSubject: Re: THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE   THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 I_icon_minitimeSat Feb 23, 2013 11:28 am

@Kenneth_B wrote:


THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 LeiaPOCH_zps017607d3

THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 LeiaPOCH_2_zpse7f53eb8

Please notice that these three Poch Leia Hoth figures are identical (coo, paint etc) but NOT with the same coo as the sample in Wolff's Poch guide. Wolff's sample also has green eye brows in addition, while two of these have brown eyebrows. On the last of them the eye brows are almost gone. I now have had four identical samples of this Leia Hoth variant in my hands - all from different sourches/collections in Spain and, all have the same Poch characteristicas. So are there two different Poch Leia Hoth variants in existance, or are Wolff's and/or my Leia's mixed up figures with Kenner/Poch limbs? Impossible to say for sure of course but with four identical samples found by my hands, I have no doubts, that the Leia Hoth's in these pics are Poch produced.


Today I received a Leia Hoth from Spain which looks very similar as the three figures in Kenneth's For Sale thread.

I started looking for a Kenner Leia having the same COO #2, and was lucky to found one among the few which I own. Accidently it was my Leia Hoth childhood figure, my first Leia ever. As a child I never would have realised that those small letters on the legs could be of any importance one day. Very Happy

Here are the comparison pics:

Leia Hoth, COO #2: Left (Kenner), Right (Figure from Spain).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7139_zps5e334c1d

Leia Hoth, COO #2: Left (Kenner), Right (Figure from Spain).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7140_zps102493f3

Leia Hoth, COO #2: Left (Kenner), Right (Figure from Spain).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7141_zps230bb518

Leia Hoth, COO #2: Left (Kenner), Right (Figure from Spain).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7142_zpsbd94f870

Leia Hoth, COO #2: Left (Kenner), Right (Figure from Spain).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7143_zps7a41d0a0

Leia Hoth, COO #2: Left (Kenner), Right (Figure from Spain).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7145_zps87441e05


Compared to her Kenner sister, the Leia from Spain has:
- A face which is cast in a darker coloured ("tanned") plastic
- Pale coloured hips
- Greenish brown boots

The same differences can be observed for the Leia figures in Kenneth's pictures.

Below you see a comparison between the Kenner Leia, Spanish Leia, and two confirmed POCH figures which are described on Wolff´s site: Leia Hoth, and Luke Farmboy

http://swspaceclub.com/wbobafett/poch-variants/leia-hoth/

http://swspaceclub.com/wbobafett/poch-variants/luke-farmboy/

From left to right: 1. Leia (Kenner). 2. Leia (from Spain). 3. POCH Leia. 4. POCH Luke (not a DT saber BTW, just a broken tip Very Happy).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7146_zps60af2226


It is clear that the confirmed POCH Leia Hoth is different compared to the other Spanish Leia. They have different COOs (COO #1 vs #2) and corresponding moulds (rough vs smooth emblem is the most obvious difference), and different paint apps on the face.
But there are is also some striking similarity: Both Leias - one of which is a confirmed POCH figure- have the same greenish brown boots. Also the POCH Luke Farmboy has the same boot colours!!

The Spanish Leia also has some factory imperfections, which can be regarded as a bonus on top of the obvious paint differences compared to the Kenner figure. All together these are indications that this Spanish Leia might be a POCH variant as well, like the other confirmed POCH Leia.

I might be completely wrong here, so would like to hear your opinion about this Leia figure.

Would also be good to have pictures of POCH MOCs....



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PostSubject: Re: THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE   THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 I_icon_minitimeMon Feb 25, 2013 2:56 pm

Follow up from page 20, where Kenneth and I were discussing a possible POCH Han Hoth:

http://www.imperialgunneryforum.com/t4427p285-the-poch-pbp-discussion-thread

Recently I received another Han from Spain.

In the pictures below he is put on the right side. In the middle you see the Han which was discussed before.

THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7155_zpsb171a5af

THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7156_zpsafa72d8c

THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7157_zps37d70cc0

THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7158_zpse5d65d73



To me the middle and right Han look the same.

"Fat" eye brows: CHECK
Pale hands: CHECK
Pale neck: CHECK
Small belt buckle: CHECK
COO#1: CHECK

So I am 80% sure this is a POCH variant now. Only need MOC proof to confirm now.

BTW: The figure on the far left was obtained from a Spanish childhood collection. He has flesh/pink coloured hands and neck. Looks like a normal Kenner figure which was maybe imported and put on a Spanish card. But maybe you have another opinion?
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PostSubject: Re: THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE   THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 I_icon_minitimeSat Mar 02, 2013 10:53 am

THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Biker_15

Below a comparison is made between the Made in Macao (COO#3) and PBP Biker Scout (COO#6). According to Wolff, the no COO scar of the PBP Biker Scout was derived from COO#3 by removing “Macao” (scar in a scar). The Macao Biker Scout on its turn was derived from COO#2 by removing “Hong Kong” and replacing it by ”Macao”.

So it would makes sense that both figures share the same mould characteristics, despite their COO differences as they belong to the same COO family. I was curious and made some comparison pics to check this.
To me it indeed seems that both figures share the same mould characteristics. What do you think?

Biker Scout: Macao (left), PBP (right).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7164_zpsc038ffb2

Biker Scout: Macao (left), PBP (right).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7165_zps7080b810

Biker Scout: Macao (left), PBP (right).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7166_zpsf8387a23

Biker Scout: Macao (left), PBP (right).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7167_zps8b63a283



Despite their similarities, both figures still appear quite different. Compared to his Macao brother, the PBP Biker Scout has
- A more detailed (“hard”) torso and head
- Different spay mask used for the “eyes”, pouches on the hip.
- More? (except for the different COOs Very Happy )

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PostSubject: Re: THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE   THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 I_icon_minitimeSat Mar 02, 2013 11:31 am

Below a comparison is made between two Iggy’s. The one on the right was bought as a POCH figure from Spain, the other is my Kenner childhood figure sharing the same COO.
I was curious whether there were any (paint) differences between the two figures, not counting any factory imperfections.

I see only one difference, but it is a very cool one, making IG-88 even more bad ass than he already is.
Q: Can you see it too?

IG-88: Kenner (left), Figure from Spain (right).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7151_zps4b7febc9

IG-88: Kenner (left), Figure from Spain (right).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7152_zpsdc03c205

IG-88: Kenner (left), Figure from Spain (right).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7153_zps00027b2b

IG-88: Kenner (left), Figure from Spain (right).
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7154_zps6e540a7f



A: The paint used for the "sensors" of the Spanish Iggy is not dull orange but a very vibrant red.

And you know what, it is the exact same paint which is used for the confirmed POCH Bespin Guard!!

Noticing that, that totally made my day. Very Happy

THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7170_zpsa4344fa6

THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 IMG_7172_zpsb467d339


My conclusion therefore: We are looking at a POCH IG-88 here!!
This bad ass Iggy immediately enters my personal top-5 of POCH variants. cheers

THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 250px-IG-88



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The_Dark_Artist
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PostSubject: Re: THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE   THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 I_icon_minitimeSat Mar 02, 2013 1:01 pm

Love the detective work Marco : ) Bravo!
Also, cool to read about Wolff's knowledge on the MACAO and PBP Biker Scout coo/scars. Very interesting to learn where and how they derived... Thanks to both of you for your hard work!
-Steve
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PostSubject: Re: THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE   THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 I_icon_minitimeSat Mar 02, 2013 3:04 pm

Hi Dr Dengar,

again you are doing a great job.

here is my little contribution. I am not an expert so you can take your own conclusions.

Here you are my leia hoth.
Always, on the left leia from local -Spain- childhood collection, center (kenner), on the right local -Spain- childhood collection.

THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Varias021
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Varias022n
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Varias025x
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Varias032
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Varias031
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Varias030
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Varias033
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Varias037
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Varias036b
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Varias035o
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Varias034
THE POCH/PBP GUIDE & DISCUSSION THREAD - PART ONE - Page 14 Varias033

What I see:
-Face: kenner face is paler that local figures. they are darker.
-Hair: kenner hair is darker -black- than local figuers -more brownish-. It is hard to see in the pictures but it happens.
-arms and legs in the kenner one is whiter than local figures
-Boots: all 3 have the same color.
-bottom: more "clean" paint layer in the kenner one
-bottom2: no extra mark in the kenner one where the 2 pieces join. Local figures have plastic burr there.
-Hip color: Kenner uses the same body color but local figures use more pale color.

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