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 Response To Sergio Thegame-sw In The POCH/PBP Discussion Thread

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olisuds
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PostSubject: Response To Sergio Thegame-sw In The POCH/PBP Discussion Thread   Mon Dec 03, 2012 9:46 am

EDIT BY DR DENGAR: IN ORDER TO DO NOT FURTHER DERAIL THE POCH THREAD, ALL OFF TOPIC POSTS WERE MOVED TO THIS THREAD IN THE ORDER OF APPEARANCE.

PLEASE CONTINUE DISCUSSING HERE.



@javiswspain wrote:
Hi all,

Well, after the latest posts on this thread i have been asked a favour by a good friend of mine becouse he cant post yet.
Here is his message, i am not responsable for his oppinions, i am just an intermediary, so if you want to reply , you can do it directly to his email :

serge1995@hotmail.es

Thanks all,

Javi
----------------------------------SERGIO´S MESSAGE------------------------------------------------------------

“Hi all,

Sorry in advance for my inglish, as you may know i am not inglish native.
I am Sergio Sierra aka”The Game-sw”,however i am not a collector anymore, i am still very interested on the SW vintage Spanish stuff and i am collaborating with JaviSWSpain in the PBP research.I am not member of the fórums but i read them very often.
After the reading of the latest posts on this forum about PBP , i have asked Javi to post my reply until i could reply myself.And i want to reply becouse i am tired widely of Reading posts with difamations about my person(aswell other Spanish collectors) and WRONG/INCOMPLETE information posted by the people known as “PBP/Poch experts”.I really would loved no to be pushed to write this post…
Ok, Here we go…

To Lee_m about the Black Pouch Chewie POCH:

I guess your posts are a joke?? Are you kidding me? Ok,Lee,May i ask your “expert”opinión about The BP Chewie listed on Ebay?? Is that Poch or Kenner??



oh, i forgot!!!!You just repeat what Wolff says!!!According with Wolff it must be Kenner!!! becouse only the figures he owns /know are the truly Poch ones!!!LOL!!speakless…………..
3 years ago just 4 figures were supposted to be Poch exclusive , today thanks to the research of other spanish collectors, the spanish people know a bit more about PBP/Poch, far away from what the “Poch experts” in this forum could even imagine.

To Oli:

Oli wrote on a reply to Luis(Infantelo)collection.

“Lili Ledy, Glaslite, Top Toys, Takara, PBP all have unique paint applications, COO, moulds, sculpts etc. Classifying a figure purely based on factory errors or discolouration is crazy and no one is going to take that kind of collecting seriously.”

How you are been able to despise the collection of a person who you dont know at all?? Just one of the MOC´s Poch that Luis have in his collection is more valuable that two collections as yours!!
Seriously, You???you, the one who have an snoob collection?? You? The one who looking for the “Hot Figure of the week” on the forums as a way to collect??You? you even dont have your own opinion, you didnt make your own research, and just repeat what others says!!You asked for proofs and info from others collectors - i.e ackbar 100- to be “worth people” of your attention .Plus for what i have read so far ,you didnt provided any kind of usefull info for the collector´s comunity on the forums at all.What about if other people understimate your – IMHO ridiculous collection- in the first post you made??If i were you i will start for apologize Luis, at least.Obiously you dont know a Word of PBP, you even still thinking that PBP and Poch are two different companies !and what is more sad, it doesnt matters to you if POCH and PBP are the same or not!!! Very sad…

To Wolff about this post:

“Most important is that the figures have to appear on the early Poch cards, so no CCP, no Tie Pilot, no Luke Hoth possible or whatelse is out there and claimed to be Poch in the last month! You can find meltmarks on all Kenner figures as well.
The next problem is: Poch seem to have used overstock parats from Asian factories. So a lot of Poch figures are mixed up with those parts. The challenge is to find the "pure" Poch figure and this is normally only ONE variant! If I hear 2, 3 or more variants it chukkles me because thats simply not possible on most! Its mixed up trash...no variant at all...a factory error if you will...."


Do you really think is this true??trash??? are you saying that collections as the ones from Javi,Luis,JaviTC , ackbar 100 or any other collection with figures -which you dont know- like those ,are trash?? Or i am selling trash??Are yo usure you want talking about trash??you MUST be cautious and you MUST saving your words talking about trash locatted in collections, becouse we all could talk about HUGE AMOUNT OF TRASH on other collections, i guess you know what i mean Wink

For what i can see in your daily posts, its seems that you collect to get the respect or looking for the approval of the others collectors and not for you own fun.

And , Wolff, i will advice you to respect and take in account the oppinion of spanish collectors which have been handeling PBP stuff up to 30 years now,and no 2 or 3 as you have. Now a day , IMHO,Javi is the most reputable person to talk about loose PBP , and his knowledge is huge .He do have up to 300 possible Poch figures in his present collection to support his oppinions .Beside that, we both have handeled hundreds ,if not thousans ,of possible or confirmed Poch variants just in the last 3 years.Just taken in account the huge amount of possible Poch figures we have handeled, we have a view you never have.

And finally,Looking at the “worm wellcome” received by spanish collectors from the “experts” I am not supprised if they never chime in again to share theirs oppinions , picts or info.

For any other futher question, you can contact at: serge1995@hotmail.es

Thanks,

Sergio.

---------------------------------------------------


@Lee_m wrote:
Okay, firstly, i will reply on this thread - i'm not hiding away in emails.

Sergio - no, my posts weren't a joke actually. I was very serious.

The point i was trying to get across is that anyone who is selling these rare poch variants
for big money need better back up info for buyers. Is that too much to ask? Just the fact that
it was bought in spain and has a melt mark just isn't enough info in all cases for potential buyers that
want these rare figures. They want better back up info from you sellers.

I am not doubting yours and other spanish collectors far superior knowledge when it comes to these
variants. Indeed you have better resources there - same as me here in the uk for certain figures but
better back up info goes a long way to a potential sale.

Unfortunately Sergio, you have rightly or wrongly created a bad name for yourself here and on RS
for past dealings so potential buyers are extremely wary of dealing with you. I myself cannot recall
anything bad between ourselves but the fact is that you have had issues with other buyers in the past.

Wolff has created a cool little poch guide with the help of others. He didn't have to make it public but did
so for the good of the community. It is the best one out there at this time i believe, and his knowledge
and help with many collectors new and old has been nothing short of terrific. He has had his own issues
in the past but no-one has been more helpful and willing to share his knowledge. Many, many collectors
will agree. Variant collecting would have been extremely dull without him around the last few years.

I don't like the comment about me repeating what he says either. I can sense the rage in your email
so i will take that with a pinch of salt.

I hope you and your spanish cohorts put together an awesome guide and wish you all the best with it.
I hope that it will see the light of day one day for the good of the collecting community.

I can let others answer other things you have said for themselves.

Peace and let's hopefully move foward not backwards cheers

Lee

--------------------------------------------

@Dr Dengar wrote:
@Dr Dengar wrote:


Let's start the POCH Age of Enlightenment. Very Happy


This looks like a valse start to me.

Thank you Lee for responding in a neutral way. I hope we can keep that tone throughout the next few posts, as I don't want this thread to end in a big fight.

So peace and move one.


--------------------------------------


@javiswspain wrote:
Hi Lee,
I appreciate you did replyed Sergio on the forum so everybody can see your oppinion about Him,but as he cant reply on the thread will be great if you can send him an email aswell.
I am not the nurse of anybody, so i dont gonna waste My time calling Sergio and posting his reply, i have done it once, thats all.
Maybe the mods could speed Sergio's TIG account access ,so he can reply himself
Thanks
Javi



-------------------------------------------


@thegame wrote:


I am going to explain a thing to you. I have not had problem with any collectors. Wolff has bought me figures, Javi, You, Carlos, Ricardo, Marco, Tom Derby.... big collectors. My name is a guarantee. The people that write here and they have bought me, define me as a seller. Better, you look at my profile of ebay. No negative vote and 5 stars (less in the time of sending)

841 positive feedback.

Notice: my figures sell twice more expensive than the average. I had two punctual problems and returned entirely the money. The problem was the transport not I. Lee I did not like anything that you will doubt my figure because as seller, I have treated you always brilliantly. And you know it perfectly.




----------------------------------------------


@javiswspain wrote:
Hi Sergio,
Nice you could finally post here.
Wellcome To paradise Wink


-----------------------------------------------

@The_Dark_Artist wrote:
None of my business Mr. TheGame. But didn't you have trouble with a deal gone bad between Pat at Retrorewindtoys? I believe that is what made others not trust you... Just being honest here...

----------------------------------------------


@thegame wrote:

Hello I do not know you, but yes, I had it. It was quite very disagreeable and I felt very badly. I lost 200 Euros in this sale. I REIMBURSE ALL THE MONEY TO THIS BOY. THEN I SOLD THIS FIGURE FOR THE HALF OF MONEY (I return The company of transport one month later to my house) It Is True a word for word and this boy that you mention knows it. He knows even that I her sold for much less money.
Cheers, a pleasure.

@The_Dark_Artist wrote:
None of my business Mr. TheGame. But didn't you have trouble with a deal gone bad between Pat at Retrorewindtoys? I believe that is what made others not trust you... Just being honest here...



--------------------------------------------------------

@thegame wrote:
Yeahhhhh!!

Yes mate, I need lessons of POCH and PBP urgently! study affraid


@javiswspain wrote:
Hi Sergio,
Nice you could finally post here.
Wellcome To paradise Wink


--------------------------------------------------


@aussiejames wrote:
OK, I'll start by apologising for any public attacks against individuals character ( unfounded or not) I expect all members here to refrain from further flaming. People have the right to be to sceptical with wild claims of rare figures for example all spotted figures are Toltoys !!!!
I would like to think that we can put an end to posts not relating to the topic now. ( I will edit & moderate such posts from now on- this is the only warning you all will get )

As I stated earlier we need to ALL be respectful.

I would appreciate greatly if we can all start with a clean slate & continue the discussion & education of figures made in Spain. Can all our old & new members alike please share your knowledge openly with the aim to help the community as a whole.





----------------------------------------------





Sergio,

In the hope of not derailing the POCH/PBP Discussion thread any further I will address your post here in the watch out thread.

There is a reason you have such a bad reputation and its known about on all the Star Wars collecting forums. You ripped off Pat and he had to be refunded by paypal not you. You sold the figure on afterwards after disputing you had it. I've had 2 terrible deals with you also myself. Yes I got refunds on both occassions but you could of saved me a lot of hassle if you had been honest in the start. There were many others that had bad experiences too - weve all read the watch out threads. And why do you not have any negatives on eBay? Well that has been in discussion alot recently too. Well after waiting more than 45 days for either the figures or a refund its unfortunately too late to post a negative - otherwise you would have a truck load.

What have I contributed? A hell of a lot more in conversation than you have ever done. And I have no idea how you can knock someone like Lee who is one of the most honest and helpful people in collecting. And Wolff who has possibly shared more knowldege than any other collector ever has.

And dont knock my collecting. At least all of my figures are 100% genuine with provenance. More than I can say for your Squid heads with discoloured capes. The Glasslite figures you sent me with kenner accessories, the mint figures that looked like they had been chewed by a dog. Yes my collection might be small but as for suggesting I collect "Hot figures of the week" - what a joke. Prototypes with only 1, 2 or 3 known in the world are hardly "Hot figures of the week". I'd rather own those than the buckets of trash you have owned and sold

And why are you bitter with me? Because I blocked you from buying figures from my "noob" collection and you got all upset by it. Well I blocked you from buying my stuff because you are dishonest and because I didnt want other people being ripped off by your false decriptions.

And as for your other comments i wont bother responding to your trolling in this thread

This post is the cleaned up version and I will send the unabridged version of my post to everyone you have insulted and anyone else that is interested in knowing more.

Whilst you are on still on these boards trolling this is my last post!


Last edited by olisuds on Mon Dec 03, 2012 12:38 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: Response To Sergio Thegame-sw In The POCH/PBP Discussion Thread   Mon Dec 03, 2012 12:22 pm

It is unacceptable that you defame a person without tests.
Any mistake that I could have committed as seller I have assumed it. The problems were the times of sending (solved for months). The quality of the figures, never. The people who has bought me some figure and he has not liked it, I have returned the money to him without doing questions.
The money that I have reimbursed to Pat was mine, not of ebay.
My last message in this forum will be the resolution of ebay of this case and I am going to demonstrate you. Already I have asked to send me a copy. The matter is serious:I might denounce you even for calumnies. This is not a joke.

I do not blame Pat, he has been wrong completely, but it was a horrible transaction.

Pat, ebay will send you an e-mail that you verify that I returned the money to you across them.

I wait that the people has bought me figures in the past and in the present speak well of mine.

Oli, you look like to me the unpresentable absolute.



@olisuds wrote:
Sergio,

In the hope of not derailing the POCH/PBP Discussion thread any further I will address your post here in the watch out thread.

There is a reason you have such a bad reputation and its known about on all the Star Wars collecting forums. You ripped off Pat and he had to be refunded by paypal not you. You sold the figure on afterwards after disputing you had it. I've had 2 terrible deals with you also myself. Yes I got refunds on both occassions but you could of saved me a lot of hassle if you had been honest in the start. There were many others that had bad experiences too - weve all read the watch out threads. And why do you not have any negatives on eBay? Well that has been in discussion alot recently too. Well after waiting more than 45 days for either the figures or a refund its unfortunately too late to post a negative - otherwise you would have a truck load.

What have I contributed? A hell of a lot more in conversation than you have ever done. And I have no idea how you can knock someone like Lee who is one of the most honest and helpful people in collecting. And Wolff who has possibly shared more knowldege than any other collector ever has.

And dont knock my collecting. At least all of my figures are 100% genuine with provenance. More than I can say for your Squid heads with discoloured capes. The Glasslite figures you sent me with kenner accessories, the mint figures that looked like they had been chewed by a dog. Yes my collection might be small but as for suggesting I collect "Hot figures of the week" - what a joke. Prototypes with only 1, 2 or 3 known in the world are hardly "Hot figures of the week". I'd rather own those than the buckets of trash you have owned and sold

And why are you bitter with me? Because I blocked you from buying figures from my "noob" collection and you got all upset by it. Well I blocked you from buying my stuff because you are dishonest and because I didnt want other people being ripped off my your false decriptions.

And as for your comments i wont bother responding to your trolling in this thread

This post is the cleaned up version and I will send the unabridged version of my post to everyone you have insulted and anyone else that is interested in knowing more.

Whilst you are on still on these boards trolling this is my last post!

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PostSubject: Re: Response To Sergio Thegame-sw In The POCH/PBP Discussion Thread   Mon Dec 03, 2012 1:27 pm

Hi all,
I guess everybody knows that i am a very good frined of Sergio-aswell JaviTC or ackbar-, and if somebody didnt know , I am.
Being said that, i think everybody needs to know the reason of this thread.And the MODs sould chime in to said it aswell.
This" Watch Out" thread was oppened before a reply from Sergio to some attaks received by an other Spanish collectors friends of mine too.
As far as i know the issues that Sergio had -indeed- in the past, were solved with refunds by SERGIO AND NOT PAYPAL,and NOBODY was ripped off by Sergio as "others"DID.
Now, everybody will realice the baseness of this thread so you can decide for yourself about Sergio´s behavior.
Needless to say that, i -aswel many others collectors- had ZERO problems with Sergio in 5 years after been purchased from him loads of figures.
Thanks
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PostSubject: Re: Response To Sergio Thegame-sw In The POCH/PBP Discussion Thread   Mon Dec 03, 2012 1:45 pm

Javi, others,

This thread was started by Oli in response to Sergio's post. A new thread was started to do not further derail the POCH/PBP thread.

I understand your concern as the thread is placed in the Watch Out section, though it is not meant as a Watch Out thread per se.

I will therefore move this thread to the Off Topic section. Ideally this thread was discussed Off Side in PMs anyway.

Please continue the discussion their in a mutual respectfull way.


Cheers

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PostSubject: Re: Response To Sergio Thegame-sw In The POCH/PBP Discussion Thread   Mon Dec 03, 2012 1:53 pm


Also to overcome further polarization, it might help to refrain from giving negs, also in case you don't agree with the other party.

Respect each other's position, don't judge.

I have just given counteracting '+'s to everyone, don't make me give more . Very Happy

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PostSubject: Re: Response To Sergio Thegame-sw In The POCH/PBP Discussion Thread   Tue Dec 04, 2012 2:10 am

---------------------------------------

@javiswspain wrote:
OFF TOPIC:

AS I have been involved in Sergio´s Post, just for to trying to help A FRIEND(Sergio) to clean his name becouse I think is fair to give the chance for deffense until he can do it hiself , I may have disturbed people like Lee, Wolff, Kenneth or Oli.I would like to apologize publicly to Oli and others , If you dont want to accept my apologize, i am sure i could live with it.I personally dont want to be done with anybody untill tolk about it.

Being said that i think that NOBODY have the TRUTH of anything!!!
TBH in my oppinion NOBODY is wrong or is right about PBP/POCH or any other matter, no Kenneth, no Lee , no Wolff no ME...

But just reading the latest post in this thread i can see Spanish collectors who chime in just to share information are been questioned.Its seem that our oppinion is not as valid as the one from Kenneth, Wollf or whatever.And i can say for sure that if Sergio havent replyed ,i would have done.Not by attaking anybody personally, but expressing what i am expressing now, my feeling about the overall situation of the PBP disscussion thread.The overall feeling from Spanish collectors is that seems we dont know a word of variants or PBP/POCH figures, and thats complelty wrong.Of course maybe we havent the same knowledge as other big collector BUT IMHO wa have a wider point of view talking about PBP/POCH stuff, as simply as we have been handeling PBP stuff 30 years ago and while some foreing to Spain collectors can gets a good amount of figures , we are able to gets much more just for our loccation.
I my oppinion the thread is wrong focused, i mean, we are allways triying to sumarizate which figures are POch or not and IMO that is IMPOSIBLE!!! just becouse WE DONT HAVE ALL THE INFO!!! we will never know the TRUTH of all!!! we can say in a 99´9999999999% that we are sure that one figure is exclusive Poch i.e BUT we will never be 100% sure.And if you think you can be wrong YOU ARE WRONG.

I would like to public Thanks to people like Wolff, even with his issues in the past, i know his knowledge and contribution is HUGE but what i can not understand is why he is so reluctan to unknown stuff .This is not a compeition about who collector have the biggest collection or who have more knowledge.

I really would love to share the little info i do have.However i dont post at all becouse its a BIG effrot to me to typing inglish, majorly. It doesnt means that i dont reading.I am ALLWAYS helping people tru PM or Emails, but it seems is not enough.As far as i remember i have never reject any private question from nobody.I have a big proyect running with the help of many friends and that is taken near all my spare time and To be honest i think it will be a mess if i post the info i am handeling.If do you think i am arrogant person for not sharing info yet, is your choice.

I am ready to get burn myself
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PostSubject: Re: Response To Sergio Thegame-sw In The POCH/PBP Discussion Thread   Tue Dec 04, 2012 5:59 am

OK, this post was created for a person for evilness. This one is the proof that he lies. Oli, you do not have any credibility. From today you do not have any credibility. You are a slanderer.

I want to be useful to be grateful for his words to my friend Javi. To part of being a spectacular collector and an expert in figures POCH and PBP is a great person.




@Dr Dengar wrote:
---------------------------------------

@javiswspain wrote:
OFF TOPIC:

AS I have been involved in Sergio´s Post, just for to trying to help A FRIEND(Sergio) to clean his name becouse I think is fair to give the chance for deffense until he can do it hiself , I may have disturbed people like Lee, Wolff, Kenneth or Oli.I would like to apologize publicly to Oli and others , If you dont want to accept my apologize, i am sure i could live with it.I personally dont want to be done with anybody untill tolk about it.

Being said that i think that NOBODY have the TRUTH of anything!!!
TBH in my oppinion NOBODY is wrong or is right about PBP/POCH or any other matter, no Kenneth, no Lee , no Wolff no ME...

But just reading the latest post in this thread i can see Spanish collectors who chime in just to share information are been questioned.Its seem that our oppinion is not as valid as the one from Kenneth, Wollf or whatever.And i can say for sure that if Sergio havent replyed ,i would have done.Not by attaking anybody personally, but expressing what i am expressing now, my feeling about the overall situation of the PBP disscussion thread.The overall feeling from Spanish collectors is that seems we dont know a word of variants or PBP/POCH figures, and thats complelty wrong.Of course maybe we havent the same knowledge as other big collector BUT IMHO wa have a wider point of view talking about PBP/POCH stuff, as simply as we have been handeling PBP stuff 30 years ago and while some foreing to Spain collectors can gets a good amount of figures , we are able to gets much more just for our loccation.
I my oppinion the thread is wrong focused, i mean, we are allways triying to sumarizate which figures are POch or not and IMO that is IMPOSIBLE!!! just becouse WE DONT HAVE ALL THE INFO!!! we will never know the TRUTH of all!!! we can say in a 99´9999999999% that we are sure that one figure is exclusive Poch i.e BUT we will never be 100% sure.And if you think you can be wrong YOU ARE WRONG.

I would like to public Thanks to people like Wolff, even with his issues in the past, i know his knowledge and contribution is HUGE but what i can not understand is why he is so reluctan to unknown stuff .This is not a compeition about who collector have the biggest collection or who have more knowledge.

I really would love to share the little info i do have.However i dont post at all becouse its a BIG effrot to me to typing inglish, majorly. It doesnt means that i dont reading.I am ALLWAYS helping people tru PM or Emails, but it seems is not enough.As far as i remember i have never reject any private question from nobody.I have a big proyect running with the help of many friends and that is taken near all my spare time and To be honest i think it will be a mess if i post the info i am handeling.If do you think i am arrogant person for not sharing info yet, is your choice.

I am ready to get burn myself
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PostSubject: Re: Response To Sergio Thegame-sw In The POCH/PBP Discussion Thread   Tue Dec 04, 2012 11:26 am

Have a screenshot of the actual Paypal refund? I would love to see who the recipient is, because it sure wasn't me. What is the email of the refund you sent? Why would eBay accept a refund from you & then never give it to me? Why did I have to settle for a credit? A credit I had to fight for on the phone for months. Also the problem listed is for item not being as described & that should be for item not received. Why are you only now worrying about this? Where were you 9 months ago when this was going on?
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PostSubject: Re: Response To Sergio Thegame-sw In The POCH/PBP Discussion Thread   Tue Dec 04, 2012 1:58 pm

@thegame wrote:

To Wolff about this post:

“Most important is that the figures have to appear on the early Poch cards, so no CCP, no Tie Pilot, no Luke Hoth possible or whatelse is out there and claimed to be Poch in the last month! You can find meltmarks on all Kenner figures as well.
The next problem is: Poch seem to have used overstock parats from Asian factories. So a lot of Poch figures are mixed up with those parts. The challenge is to find the "pure" Poch figure and this is normally only ONE variant! If I hear 2, 3 or more variants it chukkles me because thats simply not possible on most! Its mixed up trash...no variant at all...a factory error if you will...."


Do you really think is this true??trash??? are you saying that collections as the ones from Javi,Luis,JaviTC , ackbar 100 or any other collection with figures -which you dont know- like those ,are trash?? Or i am selling trash??Are yo usure you want talking about trash??you MUST be cautious and you MUST saving your words talking about trash locatted in collections, becouse we all could talk about HUGE AMOUNT OF TRASH on other collections, i guess you know what i mean Wink

For what i can see in your daily posts, its seems that you collect to get the respect or looking for the approval of the others collectors and not for you own fun.

And , Wolff, i will advice you to respect and take in account the oppinion of spanish collectors which have been handeling PBP stuff up to 30 years now,and no 2 or 3 as you have. Now a day , IMHO,Javi is the most reputable person to talk about loose PBP , and his knowledge is huge .He do have up to 300 possible Poch figures in his present collection to support his oppinions .Beside that, we both have handeled hundreds ,if not thousans ,of possible or confirmed Poch variants just in the last 3 years.Just taken in account the huge amount of possible Poch figures we have handeled, we have a view you never have.

And finally,Looking at the “worm wellcome” received by spanish collectors from the “experts” I am not supprised if they never chime in again to share theirs oppinions , picts or info.

For any other futher question, you can contact at: serge1995@hotmail.es

Thanks,

Sergio.

Oh thats nice Sergio,

Im just back on the internet to read this after I was moving the last week!

Well again...nice from you. After I tried to hold contact to you! I wrote you about 100 emails since you disapeared!!!...over MONTHS!!!!...I got NOT ONE answer! Everytime you sell things on ebay I try again...NOT one answer!
I was really worried about you and your family, I defended you in front of other collectors....and now this???

I hope you have a good answer for this, because otherwise I will never talk to you again Sergio!

And yes I am serious, because you may have handled those figures for decades, but what have you really had in hands?? Asia import? Mixed up figure? Or true Poch/PBP produced figures?
I tell you what: I am the only one (besides maybe Lee) who has a complete reference set! And I do my homework and do not dream and fantasize around! You spanish guys seems to have lost your comon sense! And you seem to lost your sight what else was prodcued in the world to recognize simple Asia imports!

There is no CCP on early cards and I cant see anything special to it! It is just a simple normal figure! What you should know, because your reference set was once not bad!

This is my last words on this matter!

Have a nice day...I have to make my home a home again, what means I have more important stuff to do then talk to a once good friend, who is now insulting and blackmailing me! Wow.....still cant believe it!

Wolff

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PostSubject: Re: Response To Sergio Thegame-sw In The POCH/PBP Discussion Thread   Tue Dec 04, 2012 7:28 pm

Sergio, personally I have never had any problems with you in the past. Only deal between the two us was for a no coo Meccano DSC (Rog's old figure). That deal went really smooth.

In addition to having a very bad reputation as a seller in these boards you have now personally attacked and offended three very good collector friends of mine (Oli, Lee and Wolff) for what seems to be no reason at all. Wolff and I are even very close personal friends! All three are really knowledgeable and very respected guys in here and on RS, and have all contributed with a LOT in here in contrast to you. How can you even look at yourself in the mirror after these nasty, ugly, totally unreasonable personal attacks on those three guys? I'll not judge you yet in the deal with Pat, since I don't have all the info yet. But my sympathy is definately with Pat, until anything is proven otherwise!

I know, that you have a great knowledge within PBP and Poch figures - probably much bigger than mine. I as such have no problem with your high prices either. I totally disagree with them at times, but it's of course your right as a seller to demand what ever price, that you would be happy with. Then it's totally up to the potential buyers to decide, if they will purchase the figure(s) from you or not. I'm also very sad to hear, that you have had some severe personal problems in the past year, which forced you to sell your amazing variant collection. But your reasons for attacking people like Wolff, Lee and Oli I simple don't get.

For my part I'm very happy, that Spanish collectors like you, Javitc and Luis have decided to join TIG! The more knowledge and inputs we can get in here is much appreciated by me. It's however ok in my opinion to disagree about some theories regarding Poch/PBP figures, as long as we respect each others individual opinions in here. And we should also look at possible new PBP/Poch variants with sceptical eyes but though open minds. For my part I'll warmly welcome the new Spanish members in here!! Smile cheers

Sergio I really hope, that you will either decide to apologize to these three gentlemen - maybe more -? and continue sharing your huge Poch/PBP knowledge with the rest of us none Spanish guys. But if you decide to only be here in order to insult good guys, I would personally be happy seing you leave TIG as soon as possible. That is however only my personal opinion..
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PostSubject: Re: Response To Sergio Thegame-sw In The POCH/PBP Discussion Thread   Tue Dec 04, 2012 11:10 pm

Hi,
I am here to dialogate, however i dont gonna waste My time anymore in this matter.
Sergio came in To the forum to definding his name as a seller and BECOUSE IN his eyes the spanish people were recieved velated attacks from others collectors who takes those collections as a trash or not serious collections . I personally think that they did received it indeed aswel as me, as i have that kind of collection too. That was the starting reason.althogh your words were "polite"it hurts our feelings as hardly as the ones from Sergio in My eyes aswell as the others collector attacked , who have leaving TIG indeed.I Guess Many of you will be happy that Spanish people leaving TIG,and that sad.
Even after all this started, i post a reply taking our part of guiltyness in this problem, that was my first and my last "sorry" until i see sign of respect for Spanish people, which so far i couldnt see.Nobody wants To give up or is so arrogant To not thinking that "maybe"your words are as despective as the ones from Sergio??
So far NOBODY wants To accept My apologizes which is a shame becouse that means that you ALL still thinking you have never did nothing wrong in this matter.Dont take me wrong but To be honest i dont care too much if i dont have your approval as a collector or person To Live the real life.
Again, after you ALL did claim to spanish guys to chime in (long time ago) , Many spanish collectors who chime in To dialogate on the pbp thread ,were wellcomed as poor colectors with poor collections .To me is not worth spent My spare time with people who have insulted me and to MANY OF MY FRIENDS, until i can see a sign of respect as i did before.

Wollf,i know that you Maybe are the most knowledge person talking about variants outthere, but To be honest it seems you didnt realize that you could be wrong in some matters.it seems you haveTHE TRUTH of all when you talk, and the fact that people doesent reply To your sentences, it doesnt mean that people are agree with you at all,but Its maybe is not worth To waste theirs spare time talking with you.regularily you talk about PBP without adding proofs i.e.
Needless to say that You use To using a very arrogant and despective language and thats not only My personal oppinion but many people outthere, thats a fact.
I spect/hope from you all a sign of humility To start even thinking To still talking about this matter.
Nothing more To say about this.
Thanks
Javi

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PostSubject: Re: Response To Sergio Thegame-sw In The POCH/PBP Discussion Thread   Tue Dec 04, 2012 11:59 pm

Javi, I have known you for probably the longest time of any collector. As far as I know I have not disrespected you or your collection. I think there has been a lot of miscommunictaion resulting from a language barrier. There was many questions asked about legitimate items of great value. These are questions. Perhaps some false aquisations as well. I do not see any attacks or insults at you. You acknowledge "polite' words yet these resulted in hurt feelings. How do we get around this problem?
I see no reason for you to apologise. It will be a massive shame if some of you Spanish collectors choose not to continue to share information. This will be what the third attempt at a resource thread for Spanish figures? I still use your first one.
If you think there is a solution I'd like to hear it. I was hoping we could start with a clean slate & move forward.
I am truely sorry this mess has occured.
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PostSubject: Re: Response To Sergio Thegame-sw In The POCH/PBP Discussion Thread   Wed Dec 05, 2012 12:52 am

James...I could find the comments if you like. Do you not realise that Sergio has said he gets his advice from Javi. Javi to him is the biggest source of knowledge in regards to PBP figures. You guys suggesting Sergio's figures are crap made up Asian imports, is basically saying Javi's figures are crap Asian imports. You get that? If I was Javi I would be insulted also. That's one way you could interpret his post anyway.
You guys DO put way too much faith in what Wolf has to say. That's not to say he does not have a lot of information but FFS he ain't the be all and end all of variant collecting.

Anyway. I am hoping you all get back together and discuss what you like best...minute fucking changes in paint and plastic lol!





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PostSubject: Re: Response To Sergio Thegame-sw In The POCH/PBP Discussion Thread   Wed Dec 05, 2012 1:02 am

Javi & I have touched base via PM. We will endeavour to move forward from this in a productive manner Smile
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PostSubject: Re: Response To Sergio Thegame-sw In The POCH/PBP Discussion Thread   Wed Dec 05, 2012 3:01 am

Hello Kenneth, Wolff and me were very friends and this especially we are going to solve it privately. We have much about which to speak.
It is curious. The one who has felt offended firstly they were my friends Spanish collectors.
Lee, I want to tell for excuses you if I was very hard. But as seller and collector we have had always an excellent relation. I did not understand your doubts and sarcasm.... All the Spanish collectors of this forum are thinking. Imagine if they have felt insulted. Finally. Do not worry, that I go away. This way all you can be calm. Here the one who exceeds am I. You here are perfectly.



@Kenneth_B wrote:
Sergio, personally I have never had any problems with you in the past. Only deal between the two us was for a no coo Meccano DSC (Rog's old figure). That deal went really smooth.

In addition to having a very bad reputation as a seller in these boards you have now personally attacked and offended three very good collector friends of mine (Oli, Lee and Wolff) for what seems to be no reason at all. Wolff and I are even very close personal friends! All three are really knowledgeable and very respected guys in here and on RS, and have all contributed with a LOT in here in contrast to you. How can you even look at yourself in the mirror after these nasty, ugly, totally unreasonable personal attacks on those three guys? I'll not judge you yet in the deal with Pat, since I don't have all the info yet. But my sympathy is definately with Pat, until anything is proven otherwise!

I know, that you have a great knowledge within PBP and Poch figures - probably much bigger than mine. I as such have no problem with your high prices either. I totally disagree with them at times, but it's of course your right as a seller to demand what ever price, that you would be happy with. Then it's totally up to the potential buyers to decide, if they will purchase the figure(s) from you or not. I'm also very sad to hear, that you have had some severe personal problems in the past year, which forced you to sell your amazing variant collection. But your reasons for attacking people like Wolff, Lee and Oli I simple don't get.

For my part I'm very happy, that Spanish collectors like you, Javitc and Luis have decided to join TIG! The more knowledge and inputs we can get in here is much appreciated by me. It's however ok in my opinion to disagree about some theories regarding Poch/PBP figures, as long as we respect each others individual opinions in here. And we should also look at possible new PBP/Poch variants with sceptical eyes but though open minds. For my part I'll warmly welcome the new Spanish members in here!! Smile cheers

Sergio I really hope, that you will either decide to apologize to these three gentlemen - maybe more -? and continue sharing your huge Poch/PBP knowledge with the rest of us none Spanish guys. But if you decide to only be here in order to insult good guys, I would personally be happy seing you leave TIG as soon as possible. That is however only my personal opinion..
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PostSubject: Re: Response To Sergio Thegame-sw In The POCH/PBP Discussion Thread   Wed Dec 05, 2012 4:46 am

@thegame wrote:
Hello Kenneth, Wolff and me were very friends and this especially we are going to solve it privately. We have much about which to speak....

Yeah, we took conversation to Pm. No need anymore to discuss all in public, but I guess sth went wrong a long time ago, which we try to figure out now.

Cheers

Wolff
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PostSubject: Re: Response To Sergio Thegame-sw In The POCH/PBP Discussion Thread   Wed Dec 05, 2012 5:19 am

Hey Sergio,

I think it's fantastic, if you and Wolff can solve this between the two of you! Smile Hopefully you can do so too with Lee and Oli. But that's none of my business of course... Only my hope. Smile

I actually didn't mention, that I don't want you to be here. Personally I would love you to be here, if you decide to particpate in the Poch/PBP thread sharing your opinions and knowledge within Poch/PBP figures. You surely have great knowledge and experience within Spanish produced figures, and therefore your knowledge would be nothing less than a gift to the Poch/PBP collectors in here like myself! Smile But that choice is of course yours only.

What I wrote was, that I would personally prefer seing you leave TIG, IF you continue to attack good guys and knowledgeable collectors. That would not be beneficial for your reputation or for the rest of the members in here for that matter.

I know, that your personal attacks against the three gentlemen were probably a result of a lot of emotions, and of course there are always two sides of a case.

All I hope is, that this will be solved in the end, and that noone will leave TIG as a result of anger or frustration.

Sergio I want to apologize to you, if you considered my post as an attack on your person. It certainly wasn't meant to be. I'm just very dissapointed rergarding your attacks on Wolff, Oli and Lee. That's it!

I believe to have treated the new and old Spanish members in here with respect, but if some don't think so please let me know by PM or similar.

Sergio I sincirely hope, that your personal problems will be solved! I really mean that!!

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PostSubject: Re: Response To Sergio Thegame-sw In The POCH/PBP Discussion Thread   Wed Dec 05, 2012 5:50 am

To alll,

Just a general comment which applies very well to this whole situation IMO.

When communicating face to face, 70% is non verbal, 20% is how the voice is used, and only 10% is about what is actually being said. So normally the tone of what is being said is strongly influenced/finetuned by the things which are actually not said.

The problem with written communication, like emails and fora, is that it lacks 90% of this finetuning, and you only ‘see’ the last remaining 10%, sometimes giving rise to big miscommunications. This gets even worse when there is a language barrier, causing well-meant messages to get lost in translation.

I am 100% sure when we all would meet face to face in a bar at Friday night, we would have a great evening. Spanish, Germans, Danish, Britisch, Dutch, Aussies, Americans, etc.…. having a beer, discussing variants and women, and having fun. smoke

So best not to take any offence from written communication unless very explicit insults are being made. And I think these have not been made sofar

When I am pissed off by an email, I learned not to answer by mail, as it will escalate the conflict. Instead I talk to the guy/girl in person, or phone him. In 90% of the cases, it appears there is no issue at all, and I am happy that I did not mail back.

So to all: please reconsider leaving TIG for those who want to. You are all a bunch of nice guys and hate to see you fighting for no real reason.
Then I all invite you for a beer at the next Celebration Europe. drinking2

Cheers

Marco
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PostSubject: Re: Response To Sergio Thegame-sw In The POCH/PBP Discussion Thread   Wed Dec 05, 2012 5:56 am

Moved post:
@lfantelo wrote:
Hi,

First things first, thanks to all the good people in this forum which have tried to make me feel welcome.

Truth is, this is my last post, just after a tiny handful of them. I don't know if this post will be removed, or erased, or transferred to a better (or more suitable) place by the administrators, but all I have to say is that what I have witnessed in this thread, I hope not to suffer it again.

I am not a seller. I am not trying to exact any benefit or whatsoever of collecting... I'm just a collector who's been collecting spanish material for more than 20 years. My focus on spanish products comes from the beginning, and all I wanted in here was just to participate. But in these two days I have seen a raw attack against most spanish collectors, based on sheer smoke and without any reason whatsoever. And that saddened me. But when I read in a post how a seasoned member of this forum directly told another of the participants to "go fuck yourself" (granted that the administrator was quick enough to erase it, but there it was: hope this post doesn't follow the same path for just paraphrasing a true fact), I felt it was enough. I have never seen such a thing, and that, I can not bear.

Best to all, and hope to meet you some day, some other place, in order to healthily exchange info about the things which the other doesn't know: the only way to makes us all better.

Luis

@aussiejames wrote:
Luis, I appreciate your feelings. I do strongly believe many things were taken the wrong way ( but no doubt some things were said that should not have been said- by myself included ) I think everyone is close to starting afresh. Hopefully you can consider this as well & in the near future rejoin this thread & share your collection & knowledge with the rest of us.

"to healthily exchange info about the things which the other doesn't know: the only way to makes us all better." because this is a great idea.
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PostSubject: Re: Response To Sergio Thegame-sw In The POCH/PBP Discussion Thread   Wed Dec 05, 2012 6:43 am

Im getting a bit tired of all this. I never told anyone to "fuck off". And I was never attacking one of the new guys here with full intend. I was questioning (which is my right IMO) a few figures and always asked for morw pictures or a detailed describtion. Thats not arrogant thats my way to try to get answers Wink

I maybe wrote a post yesterday evening because I was mad seeing how things evolved the last days while I was offline! I deleted that post myself, because it is not good writing posts if you are mad!
As far as I remember I only wrote down my opinion again and wrote sth ybout wildly guessing around. But the truth is you spanish guys know better, so I will reject everything I have ever written on that theme!
In that case that means:

1. No more contributing to the Poch thread here
2. No more updates on my personal guide (Im thinking of deleting)
3. No more help no matter via pm or via email via post on that matter ( the only persons who are free to ask for my opinion are Mirco, Kenneth, Lee, Oli and Steve, people who I trust in they wont flame me for my opinion)

@ Javi (not JaviTC Very Happy ...just to be sure).

1. I may sound arrogant but you should know better that this is my way to type in english. You know me since years.
You say you dont post so much because of the foreign language and now I get flamed for the way Im typing? Maybe read Marcos post above......Im sure you get me wrong all the time!

2. I have a problem with all you guys flipping that stuff for crazy money. Indeed that is true! If you may have noticed I am the only one not flipping Poch figures and at the same time I am the only one who published his results. Thats like I do my research! And I advice good friends not to buy stuff if I think its not the real deal, and I think that is also my very good right!
I am sure I have now offended everyone who is selling Poch stuff, which wasnt my intend. I persoanlly have just another way handle those things! My doubles go to firends for free or are traded for another Poch figure. Again, I dont wanna tell people how to handle their doubles, just telling how I personally handle an unsearch terretory of the variant collecting!

3. I dont know what I have done you personally. I have pointed NOT ONE post against you. All i have writrten was comon opinions on the situation as a whole! If you feel personally attacked Im sorry!

4. As far as I have followed the Poch thread you mentioned Poch is the same as PBP, which BTW can be all also read in my guide! I dont know why people havent read it....it surprises me a bit. I hope you have read it Javi?
I didnt mentioned Famosa because JC btw didnt wanted it to be in public yet, bnot sure if he had changed his mind!

Ill try again (this is the last time) to tell you what I know. Maybe it helps your huge project maybe not. Kenner wasnt happy with the quality of the early figures (31 and 37/41 backs) They intervened at a point where the cantina aliens should be released. PBP wasnt allowed to release those because Kenner was not happy at all. Therefore only Asia import Cantina aliens got on the cards (ESB).

And the other story: You can find lots of proof of the so called "PBP" figures (no coo) on 37/41 b and c cards! The Poch figures and the PBP figures didnt changed from ESB to ROTJ, they changed from 37/41 to 45 backs! Of course that timeframe was not an abrupt change but IMO the own produced POCH figures ended with the 37/41a cards!

If you disagree I am sorry, but that is what I have found out by studying MOCs for years!

5. I know you play with my old story, why not mentioning it? I have touched up 2 figures and sold them as original. I was caught and refunded the buyer fully! I was in a very dark place at that time and lost many friends! I apologized for what I have done and Im working since then on my rep which isnt easy. I help out in watch out and spotting fakes, making guides etc.
If I'm allowed to mention this: I was making a profit of maybe 50 USD each (sold them untouched afterwards on ebay and thats what they sold less for). In contrast: IF (Im not telling that, only if)....IF a so called Poch figures changes hands for 500 USD +++ and it is not confirmed or years later is confirmed to be no true Poch variant, I personally think that is a much higher damage to a collectors wallet and the whole community.
That is another reason why I have problems which such high prices for unconfirmed stuff!

Good luck with your project Javi! This is my honest opinion!! Very Happy


To all people accuse me of this or that:

What leads me to my last point: I was accused: Im all doing this like a competition, Im only doing this because I want the kudos from other not because Im having fun collecting those, Im greedy etc.

I ask you again: Am I selling those for a fortune? Have I earned one penny with my guide or my finds?? Noooo?? Strange......I dont see me like you do...I had fun collecting those, without throwing money or earning tons of money, without trying to get every figure on the market for no matter what price, just to be the first!

Yes I had fun, thats over now and thats why leave the Poch section!

Again: I didnt want to offend any of the new members and if that sounded like that I apologize! I also have nothing against spanish people (it sounds like I would only attack those, which is wrong..)

I think you got me all wrong. Im sorry...it wont happen again! The Poch section is yours! Have fun here and meet all the nice people here!

Regards

Wolff






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PostSubject: Re: Response To Sergio Thegame-sw In The POCH/PBP Discussion Thread   Wed Dec 05, 2012 7:08 am

Bugger, I didn't make your list Sad
The "fuck off" statement was made by a person who knows he made it ( it obviously wasn't you ) Laughing
What happened to get you so mad? 3 posts up everything was all good.
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PostSubject: Re: Response To Sergio Thegame-sw In The POCH/PBP Discussion Thread   Wed Dec 05, 2012 7:12 am

@aussiejames wrote:
Bugger, I didn't make your list Sad
The "fuck off" statement was made by a person who knows he made it ( it obviously wasn't you ) Laughing
What happened to get you so mad? 3 posts up everything was all good.

Hahahaha.....no....you didnt...LOL (you know you did Wink )

Okay.....maybe I also wasnt attacked by all other statements too?? I feel Im getting flamed here for no reason! That what makes me mad.

I reread....but I feel accused here by a lot of things which are simply not true.


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PostSubject: Re: Response To Sergio Thegame-sw In The POCH/PBP Discussion Thread   Wed Dec 05, 2012 7:17 am

@aussiejames wrote:

What happened to get you so mad? 3 posts up everything was all good.

That was about Sergio! We try to figure out what went wrong between us!

Let some of his statements alone I think we are on a good way to solve things!

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PostSubject: Re: Response To Sergio Thegame-sw In The POCH/PBP Discussion Thread   Wed Dec 05, 2012 7:18 am

OK, so maybe we can understand why some of the Spanish guys feel they have been attacked ( when that was not the intention) same as you feel attacked ( & that was not the intention) ??

I'm not seeing what others are seeing, so back to what I've been saying for a little while- Can we put a full stop to all of this 'nonsense' & start again please.
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PostSubject: Re: Response To Sergio Thegame-sw In The POCH/PBP Discussion Thread   Wed Dec 05, 2012 7:49 am

@aussiejames wrote:


I'm not seeing what others are seeing, so back to what I've been saying for a little while- Can we put a full stop to all of this 'nonsense' & start again please.

I've just been catching up on these threads & as an observer it is very sad to see how things have degenerated. I also hope a line can be drawn under this before any irreversable damage is done!

We're suppossed to be a community. We should be trying to work with each other, not against each other!
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