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 FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!!

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wbobafett
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PostSubject: FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!!   FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!! I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 03, 2010 4:38 am

Hey guys,

I dont want to make up a second thread here, but I think this is a MUST for all Ledy collectors. If this one is a fake, we all have serious problems buying Burgundy Bibs in near future:

http://threads.rebelscum.com/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=4215929&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=93&fpart=&vc=1&PHPSESSID=

Wolff
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Tank1252
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PostSubject: Re: FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!!   FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!! I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 03, 2010 5:03 am

Damn!, i must admit, there has seemed to be an unusually high amount of these for sale recently. Not good news, not at all. That material looks spot on. Evil or Very Mad
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xxGANDALFxx
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PostSubject: Re: FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!!   FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!! I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 03, 2010 5:45 am

Was this bought of Ebay recently ?
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wbobafett
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PostSubject: Re: FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!!   FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!! I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 03, 2010 5:50 am

@xxGANDALFxx wrote:
Was this bought of Ebay recently ?

No traded with a RS member: Figure plus cash agianst this Bib!

But there are two same Bibs on ebay right now: see the watch out area!
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xxGANDALFxx
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PostSubject: Re: FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!!   FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!! I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 03, 2010 5:52 am

This fella has been reproducing them and selling them :-

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/vintage-starwars-bib-fotuna-lili-ledy-/260604814223?cmd=ViewItem&pt=UK_ToysGames_ActionFigures_ActionFigures_JN&hash=item3cad41e38f

Here is the auction he recived feedback for when he purchaced the 3 capes that hes been dying :-

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=250622487131

This is why i belive you have red stiching as they have found a good match on the dye to the original Ledy type
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aussiejames
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PostSubject: Re: FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!!   FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!! I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 03, 2010 6:07 am

I'm by no means an expert on these things. But normal Kenner capes & Ledy capes have a slightly different cut, material & stitching(not just the colour) So these 'HQ' ones seem to be hand made entirely (I'm guessing here) OR there are 2 LL variants??
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Plantman
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PostSubject: Re: FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!!   FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!! I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 03, 2010 6:09 am

Mine has the light stitching but does anybody have 100% evidence that one never came out with different colour stitching?

A collection of AFA graded ones might help, although they could have been fooled also

Andy
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wbobafett
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PostSubject: Re: FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!!   FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!! I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 03, 2010 6:15 am

@xxGANDALFxx wrote:
This fella has been reproducing them and selling them :-

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/vintage-starwars-bib-fotuna-lili-ledy-/260604814223?cmd=ViewItem&pt=UK_ToysGames_ActionFigures_ActionFigures_JN&hash=item3cad41e38f

Here is the auction he recived feedback for when he purchaced the 3 capes that hes been dying :-

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=250622487131

This is why i belive you have red stiching as they have found a good match on the dye to the original Ledy type

Mine cape has nothing to do with dyed or normal faked capes, because the material is the same then the original material! This is the awesome fact. There is no similar material with same lining, thickness and tuft feeling, look and length on the outside, in the whole wild world of vintage!

So this is for 100% not dyed! Problem here really is: The fakers (if its faked) found and used the correct fabric. There is no way to decide if its real or fake because of the material used (besides the stitch color)!

If these are fakes and the fakers change stitch color....we are doomed!
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wbobafett
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PostSubject: Re: FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!!   FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!! I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 03, 2010 6:23 am

@Plantman wrote:
Mine has the light stitching but does anybody have 100% evidence that one never came out with different colour stitching?

A collection of AFA graded ones might help, although they could have been fooled also

Andy

problem really is: why did they never appeared before??? And why do so many appear right now??? All mint!!!

Could be an overstock find....but why now? Ledy factory overstock parts were found in great numbers years ago!!!
Although its not the first time overstock parts can look different to the normal sold ones....see Luke Bespin head with dark brown hair!

Wolff
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Plantman
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PostSubject: Re: FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!!   FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!! I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 03, 2010 6:31 am

True, although some of psybomb's look rather weathered and original, but have the darker stitching.

I think we should maybe start a thread with users who own one of these examples giving detailed pictures and get a real good comparison of the different variations out there.

it would be a painstaking process to find the exact material, dye it for it to look sufficiently like an original and have it fool experts.

the same issue came up with the lili ledy klaatu, mine was deemed a fake for not having a leather waist strap, and only one guy came back with a "its defo real" and that was Luis Galvez.
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aussiejames
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PostSubject: Re: FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!!   FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!! I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 03, 2010 6:34 am

The 'possibility' of 2 different thread stitching was raised with the LL jawa too? Wolff your Bib for sale, with play wear might just increase in value- we know that one is legit.
"If these are fakes and the fakers change stitch color....we are doomed!" Shocked
Either way it sucks: if it's real that's another varaiation I need Laughing
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wbobafett
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PostSubject: Re: FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!!   FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!! I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 03, 2010 6:42 am

@Plantman wrote:
True, although some of psybomb's look rather weathered and original, but have the darker stitching.

I think we should maybe start a thread with users who own one of these examples giving detailed pictures and get a real good comparison of the different variations out there.

it would be a painstaking process to find the exact material, dye it for it to look sufficiently like an original and have it fool experts.

the same issue came up with the lili ledy klaatu, mine was deemed a fake for not having a leather waist strap, and only one guy came back with a "its defo real" and that was Luis Galvez.

1. andy...pm me about the Klaatu. I maybe can help I know from 4 different legit variants!!and have pics!

2. Ok the ones on ebay have slightly damages on the edge or on parts were they are stitched together. this can also be easily faked. The rest looks perfectly mint to me!

3. I dont think someone found a fabric and dyed it...I think maybe someone found the exact material...took a regular Bib cape...made a mask for the parts...cut it off...sew it together and done!!! Its not hell of a work I think. Its only: where can you find this material??? Overstock fabric on a roll maybe?? I dont know....

4. Ben said its fake and Ben is a well known collector who has had TONS of rare stuff in hands. I mean he once had 6 or 7 legit Toltoys Jawa....he still has a Luke DT collection which is one of a kind IMO. And when he tells me he has purchased the same cape a while ago and these are HQ fakes, we should really care and listen up!
I ask him for pictures of his own one...maybe we know soon more!
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wbobafett
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PostSubject: Re: FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!!   FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!! I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 03, 2010 6:48 am

@aussiejames wrote:
The 'possibility' of 2 different thread stitching was raised with the LL jawa too? Wolff your Bib for sale, with play wear might just increase in value- we know that one is legit.

I think its not for sale anymore Wink....so I think I will never get an upgrade for this Sad ....

I see the point of being real with a red stitch. As I mentioned before: Ledy had no serious QC and things can be changed during production process!
Question stays: Ben and I have seen pics (he has seen lots in personal too, I have a big archive) and NO BIB EVER HAD RED STITCH! So why do now appear a few of them??

BTW: I wrote the seller on RS. Maybe he tells me where he purchased it from! If the trace leads to the "mentioned" ebay seller everything is clear for me!

Wolff
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wbobafett
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PostSubject: Re: FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!!   FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!! I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 03, 2010 6:51 am

this is the 5th:
http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=350361192520&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

posted here:
http://threads.rebelscum.com/showflat.php?Cat=5&Number=4214901&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=93&fpart=1#Post4215873#4214901
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Plantman
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PostSubject: Re: FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!!   FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!! I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 03, 2010 6:52 am

if they went to all that effort with the cape why would they falter with the colour of the stitch? that would surely be the easist thing to reproduce.

But maybe we could get hold of a few real/fake samples and do a detailed comparison, if they have got the EXACT material then surely we will see almost real fakes if that makes sense.
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wbobafett
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PostSubject: Re: FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!!   FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!! I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 03, 2010 7:04 am

@Plantman wrote:
if they went to all that effort with the cape why would they falter with the colour of the stitch? that would surely be the easist thing to reproduce.

I asked this question myself.....no clue!

Andy....why do you have also concerns on this one???:
http://threads.rebelscum.com/showflat.php?Cat=5&Number=4214060&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=93&fpart=1#4214060
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wbobafett
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PostSubject: Re: FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!!   FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!! I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 03, 2010 7:06 am

ok this sound a little bit like an offense which is surely not is Andy. Sry for that. But you see, we all are not sure...so what shall I f+++ing do now???

Try to get my money back??Some say yes...some say no......IM LOST!
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Plantman
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PostSubject: Re: FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!!   FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!! I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 03, 2010 7:28 am

Well ill be honest, ive not really noticed the stitching issue before as the cape, texture, quality all looked ok, when i compared mine with those pictures the stitching was the only noticable difference.

Thats why i questioned if it was possible to dye a green cape LL version to make it look like a burgundy squid, im no expert on Ledy figures, but im genuinely ok with spotting fakes on the major figures like the LL jawa as ive had tons in my time.

What baffles me is, if its not dyed then how the hell have they replicated it so precisely and then decided to bugger it up with wrong colour stitching??

Only time will tell

Ha ha, no offense taken at all Smile
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PostSubject: Re: FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!!   FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!! I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 03, 2010 8:34 am

One off the good tell tales is on the inside off the cape, the armpits are cut different as a kenner one, if you take out the cape on your Bib, you can see it well (or if you don't want to take it off, i have still pic's off the inside that cape on my computer and can send them to you).

Wolf if the cape you have is not dyed and the colour and fabric is dang on, i wonder why the stitching is another colour? what could be the reason?

Also you have a worn real one you used to compare to the "fake", can you check the armpits on both capes on the inside to see if they match up?

If you are not sure what to look for, pm me and i'll send you a pic of the inside.

Also, psboym and surely jess-starwars are both from mexico DF, and Jess (Jorge) has fake ones in the past, so maybe the one from psboym comes from Jorge... maybe one off those guys came across a fabric that was an exact match with the burgundy capes and is now making fakes...

Anyway with all these appearring on the bay and everywhere i would be carefull buying a burgundy LL bib, this wil also affect these sales in the future as there will always remain some fake bibs and someone gets burnt by it.


Cheers, Dennis.


Last edited by Stargeezer on Thu Jun 03, 2010 3:07 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!!   FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!! I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 03, 2010 8:48 am

Yes this is a hot topic right now in chat.Wolff is getting to the bottom of all this.

Ya it truly is sad that now we have to watch out for HQ fake red bib coat's the scammer's all need to be sht.
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wbobafett
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PostSubject: Re: FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!!   FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!! I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 03, 2010 9:28 am

hey Dennis,

is this what you talking about???

I pulled both capes off (and it was a torture to the legit one, because its veeeeery brittle)!

But I found out:

Legit cape and green/grey ledy cape: no slits inside the armpits!
Kenner and "red stitch" one: slits inside the armpits!

red stitch:
FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!! IMG_5692

playwear legit one with pale stitch (sry I caanot pull out the arm...Im afraid it will tear...but it has no slits by the look inside)
FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!! IMG_5691


So its like I assumed: Someone found a good looking (if not perfect/the same) material and used a Kenner cape as modell to make an exact copy out of the found material???

Wolff
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wbobafett
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PostSubject: Re: FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!!   FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!! I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 03, 2010 9:40 am

BTW: form the outside you can see agian the frightening exact matching! It really scares me:



FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!! IMG_5686
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PostSubject: Re: FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!!   FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!! I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 03, 2010 9:41 am

Yep indeed, the slits should not be present from what i've have seen so far.

I just sent a reply to your pm aswell.

Cheers, Dennis.
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PostSubject: Re: FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!!   FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!! I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 03, 2010 9:45 am

This has surely got to point to a standard kenner cape being dyed, there is no other way to make a perfect match is there?

This would explain the awful dyed stitching
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PostSubject: Re: FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!!   FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!! I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 03, 2010 9:52 am

@Plantman wrote:
This has surely got to point to a standard kenner cape being dyed, there is no other way to make a perfect match is there?

Kenner has total different lining! There is no way to dye a cape like this because there is no cape like this in another color!
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PostSubject: Re: FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!!   FAKE OR REAL????....LEDY BURGUNDY CAPE!!! I_icon_minitime

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