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 Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help...

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Discobob83
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PostSubject: Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help...   Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... I_icon_minitimeFri Nov 25, 2011 6:20 pm

Hi Guys,

I got a bunch of figures that had been separated from their accessories/weapons. Among them is one of the thicker vader capes and mushroom tipped sabers. I'm struggling to match it to it's figure.

I've read several threads on this. I understand that Clipper didn't make figures, they just packaged them, does this mean that the thicker caped vader is just a tri-logo (or other) variant?

On the other hand, I've also read that the Vader figure is the one variant that was exclusive to Clipper ands was available as a a mailer? The problem is that I have found three threads/listings featuring a 'Clipper' vader and they each had slightly different COOs.

I have the following four Vaders with scarred HK COOs, do one of these belong to the thicker cape and mushroom tipped saber? If so, which one and what is the origin of the figure? Clipper? Palitoy?

Really appreciate any help.

Thanks in advance guys. Smile

Best Wishes,

J

Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... Vadercoo1.th
Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... Vadercoo2.th
Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... Vadercoo3.th
Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... Vadercoo4.th

P.S. If you need more/better photos, please let me know and I'll gladly take more. Cool
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aussiejames
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PostSubject: Re: Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help...   Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... I_icon_minitimeFri Nov 25, 2011 6:40 pm

Mushroom tip? A term I've only heard of describing an unproduced DT saber.
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PostSubject: Re: Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help...   Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... I_icon_minitimeFri Nov 25, 2011 7:00 pm

@aussiejames wrote:
Mushroom tip? A term I've only heard of describing an unproduced DT saber.

Hey James,

Sorry yeah...I meant the one that's referred to on here as the 'rounded tip transition' I saw it referred to somewhere as a mushroom tip and that's what I've been calling it in my ignorance. Embarassed (Don't even know where I saw it in the first place, probably ebay again.)

It's the one with the rounded tip transition that goes with the thicker leathery cape and the scarred HK COO though right?

Or is that wrong too? Embarassed Laughing

Best Wishes,

-J

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PostSubject: Re: Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help...   Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... I_icon_minitimeSun Nov 27, 2011 3:09 pm

Hi guys,

Is this something no one knows, or should I just be able to figure this out for myself/find the answer somewhere obvious? Very Happy

I'm not complaining, I'm just curious as I tried asking this once before to no avail, and I'm not sure if it's that I'm being stupid/lazy or if it's something that's difficult to tell or most people don't know? unsure

Anyone have any ideas? Even a tip as to where might be a good place to search for an answer?

Many thanks in advance and best wishes,

Jeremy
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PostSubject: Re: Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help...   Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... I_icon_minitimeSun Nov 27, 2011 5:11 pm

Hi mate, I don't know much about capes from clipper.

But if my Darth vader variants can help you, then I would be happy to help.

Maybe I also can learn something from this.

Is there something you can use or I can check for you ? on the figures that I have ?

Darth Vader Variants
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aussiejames
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PostSubject: Re: Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help...   Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... I_icon_minitimeSun Nov 27, 2011 6:48 pm

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Discobob83
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PostSubject: Re: Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help...   Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... I_icon_minitimeSun Nov 27, 2011 7:34 pm

@aussiejames wrote:
You've seen this? https://www.imperialgunneryforum.com/t223-darth-vader-figure-variants-thread?highlight=vader+variations

Hi James,

I've read that thread yeah, actually I think that's where I got the 'mushroom tip' thing from. In the first post in that thread Jay has a Clipper and he refers to the mushroom transition tip of the saber.

I think the Number 4 pic I posted is the same COO as the one Jay posted as being the Clipper. Here is a comparison:

Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... Zk046s

I also think the loose Clipper that 'starwizz' posted in this thread as being a clipper he removed from a baggie has the same COO as the Number 1 pic I posted:

Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... 2m63knt

The problem is firstly that I'm not certain these COOs match, but also, if they do, does that necessarily mean that they are Clipper Vaders or are there non-clipper vaders with these COOs and what other characteristics do the Vaders need to have to be Clipper (apart from the accessories)

Also, I notice that the Toptoys vader appears to have the thick, textured cape. I was wondering which other variants have this cape (assuming it's the same cape)?

Anyone have any ideas? Smile

Best Wishes,

J
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PostSubject: Re: Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help...   Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... I_icon_minitimeSun Nov 27, 2011 7:43 pm

@pomse2001 wrote:
Hi mate, I don't know much about capes from clipper.

But if my Darth vader variants can help you, then I would be happy to help.

Maybe I also can learn something from this.

Is there something you can use or I can check for you ? on the figures that I have ?

Darth Vader Variants

Hi Pomse,

Thanks for responding. Smile

The problem is I'm not sure what I should be checking. Embarassed

I'm kind of working backwards from the accessories. I have the one thicker cape with the leather-like texture and I thought those were exclusive to Clipper? (I'm not sure about this now, the Toltoys one looks similar.) So I was wondering if they were Clipper exclusive and which is the correct Vader mold/COO variant to go with the cape. It looks as though there is more than one COO variant for the Clipper Vader (I'm not sure about the overall figure mold) and there may be more Vaders from other manufacturers that also have this cape variant.

I guess the question is, do you have any Vaders that have the thicker, leathery-textured cape. If so, do you know whether or not the accessory was originally paired with the figure (assuming these are loose vaders?) and if they were, what COO do they have?

If you do have any it would be interesting to know if they have anything else distinctive about them apart from the COO.

Thanks again and best wishes, Very Happy

Jeremy
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Discobob83
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PostSubject: Re: Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help...   Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... I_icon_minitimeSun Nov 27, 2011 7:53 pm

I just wanted to add that your Vader collection is really cool btw! Was just checking out your website. Your collection is awesome!

I couldn't really tell from the pictures if any of the Vaders had the thicker capes? It's not something that really shows well in pictures. I enjoyed looking anyway. Very Happy
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aussiejames
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PostSubject: Re: Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help...   Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... I_icon_minitimeSun Nov 27, 2011 8:24 pm

@Discobob83 wrote:
@aussiejames wrote:
You've seen this? https://www.imperialgunneryforum.com/t223-darth-vader-figure-variants-thread?highlight=vader+variations

Hi James,

I've read that thread yeah, actually I think that's where I got the 'mushroom tip' thing from.

Also, I notice that the Toptoys vader appears to have the thick, textured cape. I was wondering which other variants have this cape (assuming it's the same cape)?

Anyone have any ideas? Smile

Best Wishes,

J

Embarassed I should read my own links better Embarassed As far as the Toptoys goes I believe everything is unique (cape, saber, figure)
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PostSubject: Re: Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help...   Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... I_icon_minitimeSun Nov 27, 2011 10:33 pm

@aussiejames wrote:


Embarassed I should read my own links better Embarassed As far as the Toptoys goes I believe everything is unique (cape, saber, figure)

Hey James,

I just appreciate you taking the time to respond mate. Very Happy

That's interesting about the Toptoys, so do you think the cape I'm talking about is exclusive to the Clipper? (If it is Clipper?) Do the two comparisons above look like matches to you?

-J
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PostSubject: Re: Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help...   Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... I_icon_minitimeMon Nov 28, 2011 12:42 pm

@Discobob83 wrote:
Hi Pomse,

Thanks for responding. Smile

The problem is I'm not sure what I should be checking. Embarassed

I'm kind of working backwards from the accessories. I have the one thicker cape with the leather-like texture and I thought those were exclusive to Clipper? (I'm not sure about this now, the Toltoys one looks similar.) So I was wondering if they were Clipper exclusive and which is the correct Vader mold/COO variant to go with the cape. It looks as though there is more than one COO variant for the Clipper Vader (I'm not sure about the overall figure mold) and there may be more Vaders from other manufacturers that also have this cape variant.

I guess the question is, do you have any Vaders that have the thicker, leathery-textured cape. If so, do you know whether or not the accessory was originally paired with the figure (assuming these are loose vaders?) and if they were, what COO do they have?

If you do have any it would be interesting to know if they have anything else distinctive about them apart from the COO.

Thanks again and best wishes, Very Happy

I just wanted to add that your Vader collection is really cool btw! Was just checking out your website. Your collection is awesome!

I couldn't really tell from the pictures if any of the Vaders had the thicker capes? It's not something that really shows well in pictures. I enjoyed looking anyway.

Jeremy

Hi Jeremy, I don't think I have a clipper or Top Toys figure yet. I must say I really do not know how such figures look like.

Some of the capes do not look like the same, some looks bigger and feels different.

I don't know if the capes is from the same figure they are on. I have not been the only owner and kids could have swapped them around.

Thanks for the kind words mate Very Happy


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PostSubject: Re: Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help...   Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... I_icon_minitimeMon Nov 28, 2011 1:54 pm

I don't know whether this will be of any help, but I have a carded Palitoy 65 bk Vader with the thick, 'leather' textured cape and the transition tip. Obviously I don't know what the COO on the figure is, but the COO on the card is 'Made In Hong Kong'.

I also have a Tri-Logo Vader with what appears to be a smoother/less textured 'leather' cape, also Made In Hong Kong.

Unfortunately my loose vaders all have Kenner cross hatched capes.

Unless there are people with loose, untampered figures it may be difficult for you to correctly match the accessories to the correct figure.





Last edited by cantina_patron on Mon Nov 28, 2011 2:21 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help...   Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... I_icon_minitimeMon Nov 28, 2011 2:19 pm

One of your COOs looks like the one on the left, I think.

Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... IMG_4510

In that case it might be a Palitoy Vader which also came with a 'leather' feel cape.

Darth Vader

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PostSubject: Re: Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help...   Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... I_icon_minitimeMon Nov 28, 2011 6:47 pm

@Dr Dengar wrote:
One of your COOs looks like the one on the left, I think.

In that case it might be a Palitoy Vader which also came with a 'leather' feel cape.


Is it the one in the second of the four pics? I did a comparison, and it's certainly very close. I'm not sure if they're the same or not. In the Palitoy COO, the '1' of '1977' is higher than the 'I' of 'G.M.F.G.I.', on my figure it's the other way around. Also, is the Palitoy the variat that always has the 'H' of Hong Kong still visible? (On my figure only a tiny part of the H is still visible) I'm not sure, what do you think?
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PostSubject: Re: Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help...   Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... I_icon_minitimeMon Nov 28, 2011 6:49 pm

@pomse2001 wrote:


Hi Jeremy, I don't think I have a clipper or Top Toys figure yet. I must say I really do not know how such figures look like.

Some of the capes do not look like the same, some looks bigger and feels different.

I don't know if the capes is from the same figure they are on. I have not been the only owner and kids could have swapped them around.

Thanks for the kind words mate Very Happy



No worries.

I appreciate you taking the time to help. Smile

-J
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PostSubject: Re: Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help...   Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... I_icon_minitimeMon Nov 28, 2011 6:54 pm

@cantina_patron wrote:
I don't know whether this will be of any help, but I have a carded Palitoy 65 bk Vader with the thick, 'leather' textured cape and the transition tip. Obviously I don't know what the COO on the figure is, but the COO on the card is 'Made In Hong Kong'.

I also have a Tri-Logo Vader with what appears to be a smoother/less textured 'leather' cape, also Made In Hong Kong.

Unfortunately my loose vaders all have Kenner cross hatched capes.

Unless there are people with loose, untampered figures it may be difficult for you to correctly match the accessories to the correct figure.




Yep, that's the problem in a nutshell. On carded figures you can't see the C.O.O., on losse figures you can see the C.O.O. but can't verify the accessories unless you personally took the figure from the card. Evil or Very Mad Laughing

That's interesting about the Palitoy carded Vader though. It fits with what Dr Dengar is saying. I'm not sure the COO on my figure matches the Palitoy COO though. What do you think?
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PostSubject: Re: Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help...   Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... I_icon_minitimeMon Nov 28, 2011 11:34 pm

@Discobob83 wrote:

Is it the one in the second of the four pics? I did a comparison, and it's certainly very close. I'm not sure if they're the same or not. In the Palitoy COO, the '1' of '1977' is higher than the 'I' of 'G.M.F.G.I.', on my figure it's the other way around. Also, is the Palitoy the variat that always has the 'H' of Hong Kong still visible? (On my figure only a tiny part of the H is still visible) I'm not sure, what do you think?

In general those tiny differences between COOs don't matter. Most likely they indicate steel moulds that travelled together and were used in parallel during production of the figures in a factory. So both COOs can be found for the Palitoy Darth Vader IMO.

Just to give you an idea, here are examples of nearly identical COOs which were shipped to Mexico for production of Ledy figures:

Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... IMG_3932

Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... LL_Nikto_comparision_Ledys_coo

From Wolff's post on RS: http://forum.rebelscum.com/t1072470/

Wolff wrote:
I have no proof of the following but to me it makes totally sense: The steel-molds were the original ones, the ones the first shots were made from. These were duplicated in steel, aluminium or brass. Aluminium and brass are more easy to work with because they are much „softer“ then steel. Especially for the limbs (very soft plastic, less wear) no steel molds were necessary. In aluminium or also brass it would be possible to stamp the coos in with a lettering sytem similar to old printing systems. You have all letters made in steel which can be set together in the way you want them and get „hammered“ into the molds. Therefore you would need softer materials then steal and it would explain many nearly similar COOs which just one letter out of line next to one where all letters are in line or another letter which is out of line.


Wolff wrote:
Another aspect from the coo-family is: Same mold but slightly different coo. Regarding the LXW again there can be two slightly different HK coos found. These 2 molds always traveled together and also were altered together.

Hope this helps.

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PostSubject: Re: Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help...   Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... I_icon_minitimeTue Nov 29, 2011 4:59 am

[/quote]
That's interesting about the Palitoy carded Vader though. It fits with what Dr Dengar is saying. I'm not sure the COO on my figure matches the Palitoy COO though. What do you think?[/quote]

Looking at the pictures the two COO's are a very good match, despite the height differences between the I & 1.
As discussed by Dr Dengar, I have also been lead to believe that there can be subtle differences between moulds from the same factory.

I can empathise with your dilema, as I also like to ensure each figure variant is paired with the correct accessories, and as you are finding some can be quite difficult & frustrating. It's all part of of collecting lol!
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PostSubject: Re: Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help...   Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... I_icon_minitimeTue Nov 29, 2011 2:11 pm

@Discobob83 wrote:
@pomse2001 wrote:


Hi Jeremy, I don't think I have a clipper or Top Toys figure yet. I must say I really do not know how such figures look like.

Some of the capes do not look like the same, some looks bigger and feels different.

I don't know if the capes is from the same figure they are on. I have not been the only owner and kids could have swapped them around.

Thanks for the kind words mate Very Happy



No worries.

I appreciate you taking the time to help. Smile

-J

Thanks mate. Maybe I can also learn something on this thread Shocked
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PostSubject: Re: Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help...   Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 30, 2011 9:22 am

Hi Guys,

Sorry for the slow reply. Nightmare day yesterday.

Thanks so much for your help. The C.O.O. explanation makes sense and if you think it's a Palitoy Vader that's good enough for me. So, I have a match for the accessories which I appreciate hugely. I'm just left wondering about the other two COOs and wheteher they are or aren't Clippers (or some other variant) and may als be matches for the accessories?

Is the Palitoy cloak the same as the Clipper cloak?

Thanks again guys. Smile

-J
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PostSubject: Re: Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help...   Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 30, 2011 11:36 am

I would be happy to see some pictures of the capes compared Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help...   Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 30, 2011 12:11 pm

@pomse2001 wrote:
I would be happy to see some pictures of the capes compared Very Happy

Hi Mate,

I took quite a good photo of the leathery/textured cape I've been talking about. You can see the surface texture quite clearly here and how it differs from a standard cape. As for whether this is a Palitoy Cape or a Clipper cape (or whether they're the same thing?) I'll leave to somene more knowledgable. Smile

Vader - Scarred 'Hong Kong' COO ID Help... 27y6440

Hope this helps?

-J
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