Thanks Merlin, your suspected TT Vader does look very much like mine. However I don't believe it to be a TT vader as, although cast from a ledy figure, the TT vader has no coo and no peg holes, so is quite easy to identify  :scratch: Also having been cast from another figure, the TT is slightly smaller than all other licensed figures, very similar in scale to the '95 potf re-release, also the TT has a slightly squashed looking face, making it look quite different from Ledy and MIM figures.

here is my TT moc for comparison, you can see quite close up detail, by clicking on the 'click to see full size' tab above the pic.



The cape on your figure does look interesting though. It looks quite leathery in texture, like a TT cape.

so you are definitely sure that your figure, pictured on the left in your first pic, is definitely not an early HK coo Ledy?

chris.75 wrote:

Thanks Merlin, your suspected TT Vader does look very much like mine. However I don't believe it to be a TT vader as, although cast from a ledy figure, the TT vader has no coo and no peg holes, so is quite easy to identify  :scratch: Also having been cast from another figure, the TT is slightly smaller than all other licensed figures, very similar in scale to the '95 potf re-release, also the TT has a slightly squashed looking face, making it look quite different from Ledy and MIM figures.

here is my TT moc for comparison, you can see quite close up detail, by clicking on the 'click to see full size' tab above the pic.



The cape on your figure does look interesting though. It looks quite leathery in texture, like a TT cape.

so you are definitely sure that your figure, pictured on the left in your first pic, is definitely not an early HK coo Ledy?

Chris..... yes the cape looks like leathery like the TT cape.
Buuuuumer!!.....THEN back to where I begin ...       
The probelm is that I dont have it here with me...

merlin wrote:

Let me ask Alonso Vilches, expert in this kind of info.he will know the exact time when Lili ledy realeased the Imperio figures to the market.

psybertech wrote:

Hey guys, a generic question....

Reading up on part 1's first page about the history of Lili Ledy, the year stated they started releasing figures was 1982.
By chance does anyone know if it was early 1982 or late?

Part of my research on things.

Thanks!

I already ask Alonso Vilches and he told me the first set was release early 1982 .
For those who dont know , Alonso is considered the #1 source of information about all Mexican Star wars memorabilia.

merlin wrote:

merlin wrote:

Let me ask Alonso Vilches, expert in this kind of info.he will know the exact time when Lili ledy realeased the Imperio figures to the market.

psybertech wrote:

Hey guys, a generic question....

Reading up on part 1's first page about the history of Lili Ledy, the year stated they started releasing figures was 1982.
By chance does anyone know if it was early 1982 or late?

Part of my research on things.

Thanks!

I already ask Alonso Vilches and he told me the first set was release  early 1982  .
For those who dont know , Alonso is considered the #1 source of information about all Mexican Star wars memorabilia.

Thank you! I was hoping for early 1982.

I bought this TFP on ebay a couple of weeks back and I think it might be Ledy, as the coo looks slightly different from the PBP coo on Wolff's old guide.
If anyone could confirm it for me, it would be much appreciated.

I tried checking verification on the first page of the LL discussion thread part 1, but your pics are down again Marco





unfortunately he has lost most of the paint to his hands and boots, as well as his shoulder emblems.
When I bought it from the U.K seller it had been very crudely touched up with acrylic paint. Really thickly applied with a brush, but came off really easily with a little warm, soapy water. He had listed it originally as buy it now for about £15, but re listed it for auction after there was no takers. I won it for about a fiver, so am pretty chuffed to have this variant, despite the paint loss. But I haven't left feedback for the seller  

Chris,

The helmet emblems are the key as the scarred COO is shared by LL, PBP and Meccano



The photo above was stolen off Marco and shows left to right.... Kenner/PBP/Lili Ledy

 


Thanks Stef   

Did anyone see this 'shocking' auction several weeks ago?...

eBAY seller wrote:

You´re bidding on a Star Wars Lili Ledy Darth Vader Retorno Variant Figure with a Scarce and Hard Finding Saber. The figure is all complete and in near mint condition with minor signs of wear. The cape is made of cloth as you can see, it comes with the COO clearly and visible Honk Kong and the letter H is left aligned with the M of G.M.F.G.I. 1977. The gun or lightsaber has no letters on it, some of the common Lili Ledy´s sabers have letters on them. I got it from a Lili Ledy Star Wars collector, when I asked him about the cloth cape his answer was: that he have had that figure since he was a kid, mexican creativity???  The cloth cape is in good condition, so is the skirt around Darth Vader´s body. The joints or limbs are tight. In my opinion is a 100% original Darth Vader Retorno figure with a hard finding and scarce lightsaber or gun. This would be a great addition to your Lili Ledy´s Star Wars collection.

I think the inner skirt belongs to the ERG, and the cape I'd guess at squidhead? But both have been dyed black!!

walkie wrote:

Did anyone see this 'shocking' auction several weeks ago?...

eBAY seller wrote:

You´re bidding on a Star Wars Lili Ledy Darth Vader Retorno Variant Figure with a Scarce and Hard Finding Saber. The figure is all complete and in near mint condition with minor signs of wear. The cape is made of cloth as you can see, it comes with the COO clearly and visible Honk Kong and the letter H is left aligned with the M of G.M.F.G.I. 1977. The gun or lightsaber has no letters on it, some of the common Lili Ledy´s sabers have letters on them. I got it from a Lili Ledy Star Wars collector, when I asked him about the cloth cape his answer was: that he have had that figure since he was a kid, mexican creativity???  The cloth cape is in good condition, so is the skirt around Darth Vader´s body. The joints or limbs are tight. In my opinion is a 100% original Darth Vader Retorno figure with a hard finding and scarce lightsaber or gun. This would be a great addition to your Lili Ledy´s Star Wars collection.

The inner skirt belongs to the ERG, and the cape I'd guess at squidhead? Both dyed black!!  

A friend of mine bought that vader and sent it to me for a 'closer' look after he had won the auction. Both capes are custom the material used on them is pretty thin. The nice score on this was the saber, a very fragile and rare variation for early LL Vaders.
I know 9-10 of this sabers:

Regular LL Vader saber on bottom, early LL Vader sabers on top.

So it seems so good came of the auction after all?

Wow, so still a score, despite the  custom capes. An early HK coo Vader with an early thin tip saber for $255.
This would have originally came with a harder to find thin cape variant.
So it would have been found originally on an Imperio contraactaca card, or were they also known to be found on El returno de Jedi cards?

walkie wrote:

So it seems so good came of the auction after all?

Hi buddy, this Vader was offered before through facebook, because of the ugly custom cape I didn't even payed attention.
I'm happy a TIGGER got it

chris.75 wrote:

Wow, so still a score, despite the  custom capes. An early HK coo Vader with an early thin tip saber for $255.
This would have originally came with a harder to find thin cape variant.
So it would have been found originally on an Imperio contraactaca card, or were they also known to be found on El returno de Jedi cards?

Yes definitely a score, and yes this would have originally came with a harder to find thin cape variant. My guess is this early Vader was part of the Imperio and Retorno lines. I have a picture of a carded Retorno example, I just have to find it...  

Thanks Ozio, I guess this figure would be fairly easy to identify on LL mocs, due to the thinner tipped saber. Interesting to know it can be found on returno cards too.
It would be great if you do have a pic  

OZIO wrote:

I'm happy a TIGGER got it

Wondering who that could be.....  

Dr Dengar wrote:

OZIO wrote:

I'm happy a TIGGER got it

Wondering who that could be.....  

Well done Marco!   

As soon Ozio mentioned "TIGGER" I had a feeling it was you Marco

Wow congrats  love to see some pics Marco   

Thank you for your comments, guys!

It was a gamble, but no risk, no gain.

Ozio was very kind to use his experience with first release Ledy sabers to authenticate the one from the auction. The seller cooperated by sending the figure directly to Ozio.

Needless to say I am very happy with this figure.
Actually I like the custom soft cloth inner and outer capes, and decided to leave the figure as it is right now.
It adds to the story: fake looking Vader turns out to be early release LL Vader including his rare saber.

And big thanks to my friend Ozio for helping me with this.

chris.75 wrote:

Wow congrats love to see some pics Marco

@ Chris: The Darth Vader figure is still at Ozio's place awaiting shipment with some other bought Ledy items. This is just not the right timing for shipping as I am abroad.
So I can't make pics for you right now. But maybe Ozio wants to make some and share with us.

UKG 95 Ledy Chewbacca

 

this may have been posted already - AFA mistake


graders not looking at eyes on either figure

oh wow....that is just...well...shame!! Poor AFA collectors (that trust the label and know shit... :/ )


QUESTION:

Anyone ever found a LL COO that exactly matches PBP, speaking of Tie Fighter Pilot??

I am preparing the sheet and I am not sure. There is several scars of each (fill in broke out...repaired etc). But is there two that exactly do match??

wbobafett wrote:

oh wow....that is just...well...shame!! Poor AFA collectors (that trust the label and know shit... :/ )

Thanks for posting those big grading failures, AJ!

Grading resealed cards (Toy Toni), wrongly labeling figures as Ledy (AJ's posted example), even U-graded figures supplemented with the wrong weapons (Stef's Takara Stromtrooper), or with repro weapons (Mirco's dengar).

Enough is enough.

I still belief AFA is an authority for the really rare items, as experts like Tom Derby are getting involved then.
But grading of less rare items, comprising probably 95% of AFA's 'production' volume, seems not be authorized at all.

AFA: Action Figure Apology


I would very much welcome an alternative grading system...at least for Ledy.

wbobafett wrote:

Anyone ever found a LL COO that exactly matches PBP, speaking of Tie Fighter Pilot??

I am preparing the sheet and I am not sure. There is several scars of each (fill in broke out...repaired etc). But is there two that exactly do match??

Here are the three scars that have been found on Ledy TFPs sofar:




The PBP TFP below seems to have a different scar, or is it COO 6B?

TIE Fighter Pilot: Kenner (left), PBP (middle), Lili Ledy (right)


Now I come to think about it, it wouldn't make much sense that the scars in the PBP moulds were exactly the same as for the Ledy moulds. Assuming production was at the same time.
That is unless the moulds were first used by PBP, then transported to Mexico to be used by Ledy.

Same question can be asked for the scar at the Imperial Commander. Are PBP and Ledy, exactly the same or slightly different?

Interesting.

@Marco
I don't have much experience with all this but to me logic states that if the mold existed in one state (COO markings being whatever) and then mould was shipped to another factory to use, at least one batch, however small or large, would be the same as far as markings and the overall mould features.

It could change after a certain period of time due to mould cleanings, updates, maintenance, etc, but I see no reason why the initial mould transfer from one factory to another would necessitate a change solely due to it changing hands.

So to me, if anyone thinks or believes that when a mould moves from one factory to another that changes were auomatically made by the new factory so it looks different is just not something I can wrap my head around and don't see it being plausible. Financially it makes no sense.

Or on that note.... did the moulds move at all?   

But I am just thinking out loud and hashing this out.

I wish Leia Bespin had more interesting changes so I could investigate.

cheers!

j

Jay, actually we are thinking along the same lines (I think ):

Dr Dengar wrote:

Now I come to think about it, it wouldn't make much sense that the scars in the PBP moulds were exactly the same as for the Ledy moulds. Assuming production was at the same time.

If PBP and Ledy produded their TFPs simultaneously, both factories would use different steel moulds, and scars are expected to be different

Dr Dengar wrote:

That is unless the moulds were first used by PBP, then transported to Mexico to be used by Ledy.

In case the moulds were first used by PBP and subsequently by Lili Ledy, one would expect to see the same scars on PBP and Ledy TFPs. That is till the moment that steel mouls underwent some maintenance, possibly affecting the shape of the scars. .


The same logic applies to the Imperial Commander, as both the PBP and Lili Ledy figure have a smooth scar (or whatever terminology is best suited for COO#4 ).

Cheers